Hi guys, passed level 3 a few months ago and hope to have my charter before next summer. Also scored well on the GMAT and will be attempting to get into some top 10 MBA programs next fall. What I’m wondering is, how realistic is it to go into asset management right out of a program like Wharton or Columbia? Even though these are top programs, their stats show only 5% of the students go into these roles, while most go into consulting or Ibanking. My current role involves asset allocation and manager selection but not individual security analysis. Do buyside firms tend to only hire people with previous sell side research experience, or would a good mba brand name + the charter be enough?
MBA + CFA will give you an X% chance of getting such a position. No credential is 100% fool proof. Similarly, we can’t really say that buy side firms *only* hire people with specific backgrounds. Certainly, certain credentials will help your chances, but there’s always uncertainty. Sorry if this is vague. The MBA will probably help, but you’ll still be rolling dice. Anyway, if you get into a good MBA program but don’t get placed in AM, I’m sure your other opportunities will be ok as well.
Am I understanding correctly that you’re contemplating spending two years of your life and tens of thousands of dollars for a shot at doing individual security analysis rather than asset allocation and manager selection, which you’re already doing?
You are in asset management now. You are in a fund of funds correct? And you want to go into a job that analyzes securities and invests? Have you tried looking now though? I would think you should be able to get into that area now.
Investment banking recruiters have some key pearls of wisdom for Columbia Business School students: http://gawker.com/5666747/columbia-business-school-students-must-be-reminded-to-wash-themselves Not sure if this answers your question, but it’s another factor you might want to consider in your business school application choices. Choose your classmates carefully!
numi Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Investment banking recruiters have some key pearls > of wisdom for Columbia Business School students: > > http://gawker.com/5666747/columbia-business-school > -students-must-be-reminded-to-wash-themselves > > Not sure if this answers your question, but it’s > another factor you might want to consider in your > business school application choices. Choose your > classmates carefully! Snobbish and silly.
^ numi Wrote: > http://gawker.com/5666747/columbia-business-school > -students-must-be-reminded-to-wash-themselves I thought it was funny 
Also, if I could, I would take this quote from the article: “§ No backpacks with you”, print it out and hand it to each coworker I have who does this. Suits and backpacks, ughhh… I wonder if this is painfully common just in Japan or you guys see it often as well.
Gold watches are so jabroni. If you want to manage money go to Booth.
it’s not easy to get into IM even from a top mba that is strong in finance and cfa. hedge fund recruiting is one off and even the top mutual funds are only looking for 2-3 summer interns total. i think what employers care about the most is your stock pitch and ability to generate a constant flow of good ideas.
Andreea_Mn Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > ^ > numi Wrote: > > > http://gawker.com/5666747/columbia-business-school > > > -students-must-be-reminded-to-wash-themselves > > I thought it was funny > > Also, if I could, I would take this quote from the > article: “§ No backpacks with you”, print it out > and hand it to each coworker I have who does this. > Suits and backpacks, ughhh… I wonder if this is > painfully common just in Japan or you guys see it > often as well. They are everywhere, looks pretty stupid though. Not just office, I’ve seen some of them entering into a bar after office for a drink, suit and backpack… in a bar, that makes you realize that this can’t be changed!
Bernanke Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Andreea_Mn Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > ^ > > numi Wrote: > > > > > > http://gawker.com/5666747/columbia-business-school > > > > > > -students-must-be-reminded-to-wash-themselves > > > > I thought it was funny > > > > Also, if I could, I would take this quote from > the > > article: “§ No backpacks with you”, print it > out > > and hand it to each coworker I have who does > this. > > Suits and backpacks, ughhh… I wonder if this > is > > painfully common just in Japan or you guys see > it > > often as well. > > They are everywhere, looks pretty stupid though. > Not just office, I’ve seen some of them entering > into a bar after office for a drink, suit and > backpack… in a bar, that makes you realize that > this can’t be changed! I didn’t realize how much of a faux pas this is. In my defense, I was lugging around a backpack for a few weeks since the strap on my other bag broke; at the airport nonetheless! I’m now a proud owner of a Tumi laptop case, it seems to be holding up pretty well so far.
IARdude Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Even though these are top programs, their stats show only 5% of the students > go into these roles, while most go into consulting or Ibanking. that’s because those are the ‘sexy’ jobs. if you know what you want to do, no one can stop you from getting the job you want. esp out of one of those schools where the network can get you infront of the right people.
It’s not easy to get into IM, even if you are from a top school. Unlike Ibanking, which has a fairly structured resruiting process and hires in droves, IM recruits (far) fewer people. I went to a Booth info session not too long ago and the impression I got was: for ibanking, firms come to you; for IM, you have to reach out to them. So you are pretty much on your own if you are thinking IM. It’s certainly doable, I’ve even met one guy with no prior background in finance who did an internship at a hedge fund. But an offer isn’t just going to fall into your lap, regardless where you are attending.
IMO, the top 3 for IM is Wharton, Booth and Columbia (in that order).
Thanks guys, looks like it’s pretty difficult to get into a quality firm regardless of a top mba. The reason I’m thinking of making the switch is because my current job is boring as hell and has zero prestige/mobility/pay. I’m at the point where I have to leave one way or another, so I’m trying to figure out if it makes sense to shoot for a top MBA or try to worm my way into another regional boutique shop or bank trust department that won’t pay much. At ~4 years WE, now would be the time to apply to schools if that’s the road I need to go down.
Interesting. Could you say a little more about the nature of your current job without giving too many personal details away?
Fred has some good insight, here’s a few more tips: * go to the best school you can get into. Even middle tier mutual funds can be pretty selective when it comes to hiring. All the banks go to the top 15 schools, but IM hiring is pretty concentrated among the top 3ish. Other schools will get some, but it is tougher. * having said that, it is not the worst thing in the world to go to a top “non-finance” school. You will have fewer competitors for things like on-campus interviews, president of investment club, slots for finance competitions, etc. (An aside: I did two mba finance competitions, and a “non-finance” school won both times.) Plus if the school has at least a decent undergrad rep, you can always info interview with those folks. * go to a school in or near a decent finance city. It is really helpful to do an internship during the school year (not just the summer) and if there are no funds near you I don’t know how you get this experience. * when interviewing with a PM, you’ll probably spend the majority of the time talking about stock ideas. So make sure you have some really good pitches. * having some industry knowledge helps. It’s tough though, because you don’t want to be too specialized that you turn people away. * be aware that you’ll probably be slogging away at info interviews or working that part-time internship well after your f’n banking and consulting friends have their positions locked up and are spending their afternoons playing softball and beer pong. good luck!
Windjammer, I manage mutual fund tactical asset allocation models. However, it’s extremely boring work because you only infrequently make changes and the rest of the time you sit on your ass doing admin stuff. If I didn’t have to do admin stuff or talk to salespeople, I could work 4 hours a week and it would not matter whatsoever. Very boring and my department is a small part of the parent firm’s business, so compensation sucks despite having generated good performance.
At Booth (or Wharton or Columbia) you are not completely on your own for IM. Historically, several of the large funds (maybe 8-10) that have a steady stream of MBA hiring (meaning ~1-3 per year) will do on-campus recruiting at these schools, and to a lesser extent maybe a few of the lower ranked schools. If you are dead set on IM (or hedge funds) I would consider Columbia over Wharton or Booth because of the advantage of literally pounding the pavement for smaller funds that don’t have formal hiring processes and also trying to find in-school internships.
VOBA Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > At Booth (or Wharton or Columbia) you are not > completely on your own for IM. Historically, > several of the large funds (maybe 8-10) that have > a steady stream of MBA hiring (meaning ~1-3 per > year) will do on-campus recruiting at these > schools, and to a lesser extent maybe a few of the > lower ranked schools. If you are dead set on IM > (or hedge funds) I would consider Columbia over > Wharton or Booth because of the advantage of > literally pounding the pavement for smaller funds > that don’t have formal hiring processes and also > trying to find in-school internships. Interesting. This is the first time I heard anyone say that you should pick columbia over wharton for IM/hedge funds. I know that columbia’s value investing program is top notch, but more buyside firms recruit on-campus at wharton. and there’s a decent number of east coast firms (wellington, AQR) that visit booth but not columbia.