Internal/divisional/regional positions…what are your thoughts on these types of positions? Does the CFA add credibility (stupid question im sure) to these types of roles? I think these types of are somewhat interesting as you do need to know what is going on in the economy and specifics about the funds that you are working with. Also, where can these types of roles lead to? I interviewed once for this type of role, but the company never actually filled the position. Was maybe looking going towards this again.
In my experience the job of internal wholesalers is to provide information (answering questions and otherwise) about the funds or fund families they work for to advisors to encourage/help those advisors put their clients’ money in the funds. There is surely also a significant straight sales component to the job also - coincidentally I just happened to hear about such a job (at a reputable fund company) that involved being required to make 80 telephone calls (!) a day. In my experience the job of external wholesalers is to use their clients’ money to bribe advisors to give them more money by sharing that money with the advisors in the form of meals, drinks, tickets to sporting events and golf games. As a sideline they also provide information (answering questions and otherwise) about the funds or fund families they work for to those advisors. Since they are paid to pitch the funds of the companies they work for, their opinions about those funds are a foregone conclusion and thus not useful. Their only value to a conscientious advisor as far as I can tell is to fetch information to allow the advisor to form his or her own views about the funds in question (which information probably won’t be sufficient to allow him or her to do anyway). I suppose a wholesaler having a CFA would be an indication that he or she had some level of basic intelligence and familiarity with investing and so might be a bit easier to deal with than the average, but it wouldn’t affect my view of their opinions about the funds in question since I wouldn’t put any stock in that anyway. If an advisor were just looking to turn as much of his or her clients’ money into meals, drinks and entertainment for him- or herself (which it seems many of them are), I don’t see how a wholsealer having a CFA would make any difference.
most external wholesalers are suits with credit cards. They cant go into depth about any products but they do buy you lunch…
I’ve probably met with 50+ wholesalers and maybe one or two had their CFA. Good description Captian WJ. From what I can tell, being an internal for a wholesaler would be miserable. You probably have a Rolodex of 2,000 folks and you goal is to nag them at least twice a month. The good wholesalers probably pull $250K+. Rarely have I seen many guys stay with the same shop for extended periods of time. The job involves a lot of travel although it is usually confined to a particular region within the US. The most popular designation amongst the wholesaler crowd is the CIMA. I don’t know much about it.
Thanks for the feedback…good info
I am leaning towards trying to find something like this but the problem is I don’t have the Series 7… Anyone a wholesaler here?
I was an internal wholesaler for two years and the description above is fairly spot on. 60-80 cold calls a day to brokers/advisors who for the most part have no interest in hearing what you have to say unless it is of direct benefit to their marketing budget (sponsoring a seminar or client event) or of personal monetary benefit to them (advisors love fund company golf balls and will try to exploit you for them any chance they get). Problem is those budgetary resources are all provided by the external wholesaler you end up working with so the internal provides nothing that the broker/advisor considers valuable at all. CFA or not they don’t care what your opinion is on what their clients should be investing in. The one exception can be some of the smaller independent advisors who don’t have a ton of resources or support from their home office and have relatively small books of business. You might be able to get some penetration and do some actual selling with those guys but at the end of the day it’s your external that will be doing 95% of the selling in your territory. About 75% of internals end up being schedulers and tending to administrative work that the externals don’t want to do. That being said, if you do everying your external wants and they’re a good guy/girl they will usually try to help you out and recommend you up and down to upper management. In this economy, though, positions in the field are very hard to come by for anyone without extensive field experience and you usually end up having to take on some sort of hybrid position before ever getting the chance to work a territory that can net you 250k. It’s decent money though, if your firm does closed end offerings and has a good comp plan you can make up to or more than 100k… if not like 80-90k. As for the Series exams I worked at a fund company that only required the 6 and 63 since we didn’t do any closed-end offerings (you need the 7 for that). You can get the 63 without a firm sponsor, just sign up through FINRA and take the exam (buy your study materials from somewhere like Kaplan of STC) but for the 6 or the 7 you will need a FINRA firm to back you. Hope that helps
Nitz25 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I was an internal wholesaler for two years and the > description above is fairly spot on. 60-80 cold > calls a day to brokers/advisors who for the most > part have no interest in hearing what you have to > say unless it is of direct benefit to their > marketing budget (sponsoring a seminar or client > event) or of personal monetary benefit to them > (advisors love fund company golf balls and will > try to exploit you for them any chance they get). > Problem is those budgetary resources are all > provided by the external wholesaler you end up > working with so the internal provides nothing that > the broker/advisor considers valuable at all. > > CFA or not they don’t care what your opinion is on > what their clients should be investing in. The > one exception can be some of the smaller > independent advisors who don’t have a ton of > resources or support from their home office and > have relatively small books of business. You > might be able to get some penetration and do some > actual selling with those guys but at the end of > the day it’s your external that will be doing 95% > of the selling in your territory. About 75% of > internals end up being schedulers and tending to > administrative work that the externals don’t want > to do. That being said, if you do everying your > external wants and they’re a good guy/girl they > will usually try to help you out and recommend you > up and down to upper management. In this economy, > though, positions in the field are very hard to > come by for anyone without extensive field > experience and you usually end up having to take > on some sort of hybrid position before ever > getting the chance to work a territory that can > net you 250k. It’s decent money though, if your > firm does closed end offerings and has a good comp > plan you can make up to or more than 100k… if > not like 80-90k. > > As for the Series exams I worked at a fund company > that only required the 6 and 63 since we didn’t do > any closed-end offerings (you need the 7 for > that). You can get the 63 without a firm sponsor, > just sign up through FINRA and take the exam (buy > your study materials from somewhere like Kaplan of > STC) but for the 6 or the 7 you will need a FINRA > firm to back you. > > Hope that helps Where were you able to go after that internal position, and what are some of the opportunities you see with it?
I am one so I can add my two cents. Some top firms are starting to strongly encourage getting the CFA, but it’s still fairly rare to run into a wholesaler that has it. National Accounts wholesalers would be an exception, they typically do. The level of product knowledge varies wildly from rep to rep. Some guys are much more “relationship” guys…golf, wine events, etc. Still, at the bare minimum, you have to be able to talk about market conditions, both equity and fixed income, without looking like an idiot; and your funds of course. It also depends on what type of firms you’re covering. There’s a big difference between working with RIAs vs wirehouses. The internal role really varies from firm to firm. You’re primary role is to support your external - follow up on meetings, provide analysis to advisors, and ultimately drive sales. And make 30-60 calls a day. Money also varies a lot from firm to firm, anywhere from $60-150k. That upper end would be when you have a very good year, not every year. The next step is going external. The career path of an external is either management, or sometimes another sales role at a better gig like investor relations at a hedge fund. Most of the time though, it’s the end of the line. But, for what they get paid it makes sense. You’re looking at bare minimum $250k and over $1mm for those really great years. Most years though, you can depend on somewhere between $350k to $600k. Wide range to be sure. The key with an external role is 1) getting a good geographical territory (you don’t want to cover half the US); and, 2) work for a firm that has a good brand. For example, if you’re the American Funds wholesaler, you have the easiest job on earth and make bank. Hope that helps.
I made the jump over to the investment side of my firm as a research associate after passing Levels I and II of the CFA (currently a L3 candidate) so I’m not on the sales side at all anymore. For those looking to stay on the sales side you can either stay in the retail channel and try to get an external wholesaling position which can take a lot of time and is a frusterating process because it’s very political. You can also try to make the jump to institutional sales which is actually a very good gig if the manager you’re working for has a well developed institutional sales force. There’s many different types of insititutional clients so there’s usually more than one “focus” or “channel” of institutional salesperson. Most institutional sales spots strongly prefer progress toward the CFA. If nothing else an internal spot is a good place to kill time and make some money while you study for your exams. Whatever path you’re interested in just make sure it’s a firm that actively promotes from the inside. You’ve got a much better shot at getting to where you want to go if that’s the case.
Nitz, What is the best way to get into a position like this? I am having a tough time because I don’t have the 7…
You don’t need the 7 to sell mutual funds. 6 and 63 will do.
Sweep the Leg is right, but some fund companies may require the 7 if their company does closed-end fund offerings since they are essentially IPOs (I know Blackrock and Eaton Vance both require it, for example). If the companies you are applying to require the 7 and won’t hire anyone who is unlicensed then there isn’t much that you can do. If you want them to make an exception for you, you’ll just have to finagle an interview and kill it once you get there. No other way around not having the license exams since you have to be employed at a FINRA member firm to take them.