I am considering moving to Toronto this winter( second week of November, to be precise). My only concern is whether I will be able to find a decent job there once I land.I am working in middle east for full time, so will be visiting only for a week and no more. From what I know, it could be pretty tough because the Canadian employers don’t recognize work experience elsewhere. I am Indian by the way, not an American, but I cleared my CFA Level 1 (USA), and had successfully completed the Indian Chartered Accountancy exams (if that matters). Of course English won’t be a problem for me, as my current bosses are all Britishers, and my English should be considered fluent (not native level though). I had the experience of working in Middle East for 3 years however, in finance & product control, there are quite limited good opportunities for me. So, guys who had moved to Toronto from another country, how is the job market nowadays?
Toronto as a city (and Canada as a country) has the most CFA charterholders per capita.
On another note, would it be better to reach Toronto after Bonus season. I mean thats when everybody is looking for a job?isnt it? When do companies pay the bonuses generally in Canada?
You cleared your CFA Level 1 (USA) edition? Also I’m not too sure if there’s a ‘‘best time of the year’’ to look for a job when you have previous experience. People are constantly leaving jobs and searching for new ones, year round.
Thanks guys . Toronto seems to be the preferred choice, however it seems to be overcrowded, so competition would be tougher there. Reggie,Yes I cleared my L1. I thought the November may not be the best month as everybody would be, you know, tied up with closings and focus is on year end results.And it is generally after the Q3 closings that companies budget for new recruitments. So, just my personal opinion that after year end results and bonuses, hiring will start. Looking at my current experience of product controller, what fields can be selected?Should i directly apply to banks like BMO,RBC,CIBC,Scotiabank, TD, and hope to line up a few interviews before reaching Toronto? Should i consult any headhunter too. Does anybody knows any headhunter in that space? Sorry…lots of questions, though any help/tips really appreciated… Thanks
CFA Four To be blunt, it doesn’t matter about bonus season, not sure where you heard that, but i don’t think it has nearly as much bearing as does undergraduated and MBA recruiting times. Most companies (especially the banks you mentioned) only hire people in investment banking, corp. finance, sales & trading, portfolio mgmt etc… right out of school. Like someone mentioned above, people move around all the time and hiring is done on a department level - mostly the not so glamorous jobs like trade clearing, back office stuff. All that said, I would play your billingual card, as everyone and their brother has passed CFA L1 (no need to specify where, USA, CAN, it’s the same exam), and has an undergraduate degree from a credible Canadian University, and has had at least an internship with a large Toronto firm. Not to mention, a lot of the positions are filled via connections with people at the company. Toronto is a tough place to get a decent job, and I would do a lot of research before deciding to move from the Middle East.
I live in Ottawa, so i’m not that as familiar with Toronto, but from what I know the market is pretty competitive. As someone else said, the number of CFAs/capital is the highest in TO. You would have a very very tough time finding anything better than working as a CSR (customer service rep) at one of those banks; so it’s up to you if you really want to move to another country for a part-time job that pays a bit better than min. wage. Hopefully someone from TO will chime in for a more-informed opinion.
i agree that you should play the bilingual card but unless that second language is Quebecois French, it generally won’t help you much. a CFA L1 candidate has little chance of getting a decent job anywhere. you haven’t stated your age but i’m assuming you’re young; if so, then you should have just as good of a chance as any new grad, though those chances still aren’t good. because you have international experience, you may find some jobs that require such experience but again, these situations are unique and far between. if you have ish-loads of cash in the bank, why not come to canada and see if you can find a home here, if you don’t have tons of cash to rely on, then its a major risk.
cfaFour Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I had the experience of working in Middle East for > 3 years however, in finance & product control, > there are quite limited good opportunities for me. In what why ? Most CAs from India will eventually work as accountants (CGAs) in Toronto.
You want to setup a whole bunch of interviews at good firms in a time span of only 1 week? And your experience had been in back office? I dont see that happening well.
LEVEL 1 CFA is insignificant. plenty of full CFAs looking for better jobs. throw in the recent MBAs from here and your credentials look weak. Without great experience, i don’t see you getting a great job here by any stretch. The canadian banking industry is pretty saturated and at a mature stage. most banks in canada are expanding outside of Canada so any new positions opening up will most likely be elsewhere. If anything, it is calgary that will have more job openings. just my guess.
MattLikesAnalysis Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > i agree that you should play the bilingual card > but unless that second language is Quebecois > French, it generally won’t help you much. a CFA L1 > candidate has little chance of getting a decent > job anywhere. you haven’t stated your age but i’m > assuming you’re young; if so, then you should have > just as good of a chance as any new grad, though > those chances still aren’t good. because you have > international experience, you may find some jobs > that require such experience but again, these > situations are unique and far between. if you have > ish-loads of cash in the bank, why not come to > canada and see if you can find a home here, if you > don’t have tons of cash to rely on, then its a > major risk. What makes you think speaking french as a second language more than any other language (outside of english) would help? I agree if it is a spot within the federal government, but asset management firms?
Maybe he meant building a special connection with your interviewer because you can speak french with him.
former trader Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > What makes you think speaking french as a second > language more than any other language (outside of > english) would help? I agree if it is a spot > within the federal government, but asset > management firms? its common sense really. we have ~6-7 million french speakers in CAD-denominated households in this country. its a lot easier to allure those within your own country than those outside of your country for many reasons (currency, proximity, tax differences vs. similarities). if you’re trying to say that having arabic as a second language in order to allure arabic speaking canadians, i’d say, how many are there and do they speak english as well? the answers are, there are very few arabic speakers relative to the number of french speakers in canada and yes, they likely speak english if they’re wealthy and have found a home in canada. there are plenty of wealthy french speaking canadians who only speak french. we’re not going after the poor non-english-speaking grandparents of wealthy arabic-canadians here, we’re going after the wealthy arabic-canadians, who very likely speak english quite well.
Thanks to all for your response.Not any encouraging views though but it seems to be hard reality as most of people view Toronto as tough market. Also, my second language is not french. FrankArabia, Calgary seems to have the most jobs, however, if most are oil or engineer related, it doesn’t work for me as I have been working in the finance/product control. Anybody else can share his/her positive views? I was looking if anybody been in the similar situation before and have succeeded in finding the job. Cheers!
I am originally from Québec and have relocated in Europe. I know the situation in Toronto is different, but in Montréal you wouldn’t believe how many people with degrees in finance end up in retail banking selling mutual funds. It’s just sad how competitive it is out there and quite frankly @ Mattlikesanalysis: is French really finance-relevant in Toronto ? I didn’t know that. I mean French canadian institutions have plenty of people who speak English for dealing outside of Québec, so for a Toronto firm who deals with firms in Québec I wouldn’t expect French to be the working language. Or did you mean stuff like wealth management ? Wealthy French-speakers usually have their wealth manager guy in Québec who speaks French.
Can I ask why you want to move to TO? Not to sound like an asshole, but foreigners finding work in their fields in Canada has been a well-documented problem. Also, I read the other day that unemployment in Ottawa (which has the highest median income in Canada and less than 5 hours from Toronto) is at a 5 yr. high, so the Canadian economy (although much better than the US) isn’t exactly booming. Reality is you will be facing major hurdles, but as another poster mentioned if you have cash saved up, you can give it a shot, just be cognizant of the major hurdles you’ll be facing.
Viceroy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > > I know the situation in Toronto is different, but > in Montréal you wouldn’t believe how many people > with degrees in finance end up in retail banking > selling mutual funds. It’s just sad how > competitive it is out there and quite frankly Isn’t that normal? You’re telling me a degree in finance anywhere else opens more doors?
Viceroy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I am originally from Québec and have relocated in > Europe. > > I know the situation in Toronto is different, but > in Montréal you wouldn’t believe how many people > with degrees in finance end up in retail banking > selling mutual funds. It’s just sad how > competitive it is out there and quite frankly > > @ Mattlikesanalysis: is French really > finance-relevant in Toronto ? I didn’t know that. > > I mean French canadian institutions have plenty of > people who speak English for dealing outside of > Québec, so for a Toronto firm who deals with firms > in Québec I wouldn’t expect French to be the > working language. Or did you mean stuff like > wealth management ? Wealthy French-speakers > usually have their wealth manager guy in Québec > who speaks French. yeah, i’m definitely including wealth management as well. overall, i would have to think that french is a greater asset than any other language due to the fact that there are french-only speakers but there are very few mandarin-only or arabic-only or spanish-only speakers living and working in Canada. i’m not counting TO-based jobs where you’re travelling the world here because you don’t exactly work in TO then do you? haha…
cfaFour Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Calgary seems to have the most jobs, > however, if most are oil or engineer related, it > doesn’t work for me as I have been working in the > finance/product control. > > Anybody else can share his/her positive views? I > was looking if anybody been in the similar > situation before and have succeeded in finding the > job. > > Cheers! All the oil and gas companies are headquartered in Calgary. There are tons of financial jobs within these companies.