ValueAddict Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > philip.platt Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > ConvertArb Wrote: > > > -------------------------------------------------- > > > ----- > > > they are experts and strong believers in the > > > strong efficient market hypothesis > > > > > > are you implying that hedge fund managers are > > strong believers that not even inside trading > will > > achieve profits? > > > > I would think they would be believers in the > > semi-strong hypothesis > > It was a joke. Did you not pick up on the > sarcasm? yea, not sure why i am such an a$$ on this forum… I am not that sarcastic of a person…
They are already on the other side of the door; they already have better keys than CFA designation to open other doors.
Vollkorntoast1985 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I heard George Soros and Warren Buffet just > started learning for the CFA Level I (After > failing in the Dec 2008 exam). They basically have > a weekly study group together (George W. Bush also > desired to join their group, but they denied him > due to his low high-school GPA). Buffett is the last person who would even consider sitting for the exam. He is the anti-CFA poster boy if there ever was one.
>ConvertArb wrote: > yea, not sure why i am such an a$$ on this > forum… I am not that sarcastic of a person… Hm me too. I tend to get passionate about certain topics and sometimes the message board gets the best of me. Its natural due to the anonymity a forum handle gives you. I am actually very calm and level headed - even quiet to some (if I happen to not know you well) - in real life.
How does one “have” a CFA? Can’t people even follow simple Ethics rules?
I have seen a number of people disregard the CFA code of ethics while in the program (specifically use of the CFA charter). A previous colleague of mine was a LIII candidate at the time and she included an expected date conferral of the CFA charter prior to sitting for the exam. Two former friends of mine decided to take the LI exam last year and both of them wrote “candidate for the CFA” on their resumes. Its useless really to argue over it. Frankly, I don’t give a rats a$$ what anyone wants to put. It just reflects poorly on them.
ValueAddict Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I have seen a number of people disregard the CFA > code of ethics while in the program (specifically > use of the CFA charter). A previous colleague of > mine was a LIII candidate at the time and she > included an expected date conferral of the CFA > charter prior to sitting for the exam. Two former > friends of mine decided to take the LI exam last > year and both of them wrote “candidate for the > CFA” on their resumes. > > Its useless really to argue over it. Frankly, I > don’t give a rats a$$ what anyone wants to put. > It just reflects poorly on them. I disagree, it reflects badly on everybody involved in the program. If the program’s own members cannot follow the rules, then how can anybody in the program be trusted to follow any of the rules, not just simple ethics rules? It diminishes the brand value of the charter, affecting *ALL* who have the charter.
i think certifications / charters don’t matter when it comes to hedge funds. every hedge fund has a unique trading strategy so if your skill set match what they need then you’ll get noticed. there’s a reason a quant fund such as renaissance tech will hire technical PHDs over CFAs, because that is what their strategy needs and dictate. a fundamental hedge fund will value CFAs instead because equity valuation / research skills would be needed. or, you can develop your own trading model / program that actually makes money and needs lower than normal creds. for e.g. George Necakov at Royce just has a BA but he’s in-charge of practially all their quant strategies. why? because he built a stellar quant-trading platform in college that they use now. kapisch?
Here’s my dilemma – I think the rules regarding how you can and can’t use the CFA as an adjective are stupid and petty. However, I would automatically ding anyone who uses it incorrectly on their resume or during an interview.
The reason why I said it was useless is because you don’t have the ability to change the behavior of other individuals. The only thing you can control is yourself. To echo niraj_a the value of the charter depends on the circumstances. Overall, the investment management industry recognizes the value of the charter for its depth of knowledge and strong ethical foundations. Reasonable people can disagree on what exactly that level of knowledge implies and how applicable it is in application. Efficient market believers and capital allocators may value the charter very highly. Whereas, strict technical analysts may not for example. You pave your own path and your own credibility is in your hands. The CFA charter will not turn a toad into a prince. A lot of studying can compensate for other deficiencies.
ValueAddict Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Vollkorntoast1985 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > I heard George Soros and Warren Buffet just > > started learning for the CFA Level I (After > > failing in the Dec 2008 exam). They basically > have > > a weekly study group together (George W. Bush > also > > desired to join their group, but they denied > him > > due to his low high-school GPA). > > Buffett is the last person who would even consider > sitting for the exam. He is the anti-CFA poster > boy if there ever was one. Is he? Just last week he said on CNBC the best thing you can invest in during an inflationary environment is yourself, education being the best way to do this. He might not be the type who believes it’s an absolute requirement, but I certainly don’t think he’d tell anyone not to do it.
BiPolarBoyBoston Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Bill Gross is a CFA charter holder. > > But the fact of the matter is that once you have > good work experience in the markets and deep > understanding of managing money in your asset > class the CFA is pretty much useless. Until then > the CFA might give you a leg in preparing you for > that experience. > > Past performance & experience is all that really > matters in this game. > > That being said every big buy-side shop will have > plenty of CFAs, long-only or hedge fund. If your > under 30 years old and still trying to make a name > for yourself I would go for the CFA even if you > went to Harvard and worked at Goldman Sachs Asset > Management. From walking though just about every office at PIMCO in NB I think they hold the CFA in high regard. Most every office has one hanging on the call. The big AUM asset mngr I worked for also held the carter in high regard and for internal progression was preferred over MBS (ie if you were working there they would me more likely to promote if pursuing CFA than part time MBA). Thats just my very limited experience. I think the CFA is more valued in the institutional FI asset mngt world than equity hedge funds.
NakedPuts Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > ValueAddict Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Vollkorntoast1985 Wrote: > > > -------------------------------------------------- > > > ----- > > > I heard George Soros and Warren Buffet just > > > started learning for the CFA Level I (After > > > failing in the Dec 2008 exam). They basically > > have > > > a weekly study group together (George W. Bush > > also > > > desired to join their group, but they denied > > him > > > due to his low high-school GPA). > > > > Buffett is the last person who would even > consider > > sitting for the exam. He is the anti-CFA > poster > > boy if there ever was one. > > Is he? Just last week he said on CNBC the best > thing you can invest in during an inflationary > environment is yourself, education being the best > way to do this. He might not be the type who > believes it’s an absolute requirement, but I > certainly don’t think he’d tell anyone not to do > it. Yes. He is. Read up on Buffett a little bit. I agree on your point about investing in yourself but he is the last person who would recommend the CFA program. And I actually do think he would tell people not to do it. He would say “read Graham and Dodd (along with their offspring) and you will get a better education. You’ll even save a few thousand dollars.”
JohnThainsLimoDriver Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Here’s my dilemma – I think the rules regarding > how you can and can’t use the CFA as an adjective > are stupid and petty. However, I would > automatically ding anyone who uses it incorrectly > on their resume or during an interview. +infinity
ValueAddict Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Yes. He is. Read up on Buffett a little bit. > > I agree on your point about investing in yourself > but he is the last person who would recommend the > CFA program. And I actually do think he would > tell people not to do it. He would say “read > Graham and Dodd (along with their offspring) and > you will get a better education. You’ll even save > a few thousand dollars.” I’ve read plenty on Buffett, thanks, and what I’ve learned is that it’s silly for any of us to think we’d know exactly what he’d say. But for you to call him the “anti-CFA poster boy” is just plain crazy. You seem to think the CFA represents some sort of investment philosophy. It doesn’t, it’s simply a body of knowledge helpful to anyone in this business.
Anti-CFA Poster Boy, 3/9/09: “…how bad will the coming inflation be?” BUFFETT: It’s hard to tell how severe it’ll be. There will be things that government and Federal Reserve can do years from now that will try to counteract it. But we are certainly doing things that could lead to a lot of inflation, and the best asset during inflation is your own earning power. Anything you do to improve your own talents and make yourself more valuable will get paid off in terms of appropriate real purchasing power. If you do something well, whether you’re a major league baseball player, you know, whatever it may be, if you’re a good assistant, whatever it may be, that’s the best asset. The–in my view, the second best asset is a good business. And you might own one yourself, but you might own it through equities.
depends where they worked early in their career. if they came from investment banking or private equity then they most likely dont. but if they came out of equity research or trading then there is a good chance they have a CFA
spierce Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I disagree, it reflects badly on everybody > involved in the program. If the program’s own > members cannot follow the rules, then how can > anybody in the program be trusted to follow any of > the rules, not just simple ethics rules? > > It diminishes the brand value of the charter, > affecting *ALL* who have the charter. ahh no it doesn’t. The reason people use CFA as a noun is because it *is* a noun. No matter what AIMR says.
naturallight Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > spierce Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > I disagree, it reflects badly on everybody > > involved in the program. If the program’s own > > members cannot follow the rules, then how can > > anybody in the program be trusted to follow any > of > > the rules, not just simple ethics rules? > > > > It diminishes the brand value of the charter, > > affecting *ALL* who have the charter. > > ahh no it doesn’t. > > The reason people use CFA as a noun is because it > *is* a noun. No matter what AIMR says. It depends on its uses. They have laid down that you are not a CFA, you are a CFA charterholder. They do this to maintain their brand recognition. As such, you should follow the rules. If you can’t follow such a simple rule then you shouldn’t have your charter.
spierce Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > naturallight Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > spierce Wrote: > > > -------------------------------------------------- > > > ----- > > > I disagree, it reflects badly on everybody > > > involved in the program. If the program’s > own > > > members cannot follow the rules, then how can > > > anybody in the program be trusted to follow > any > > of > > > the rules, not just simple ethics rules? > > > > > > It diminishes the brand value of the charter, > > > affecting *ALL* who have the charter. > > > > ahh no it doesn’t. > > > > The reason people use CFA as a noun is because > it > > *is* a noun. No matter what AIMR says. > > It depends on its uses. They have laid down that > you are not a CFA, you are a CFA charterholder. > They do this to maintain their brand recognition. > As such, you should follow the rules. If you > can’t follow such a simple rule then you shouldn’t > have your charter. Didnt you just refer to it as a noun??? lighten up. what are you the CFA police? this is an informal forum and people type responses quickly. nobody on this forum really knows who anyone else is so whats the big deal? now, if this were linked in or something else thats personalized and traceable, then it would be a different story. i post in here to vent some steam from all this *(*# studying and will never type out CFA Charterholder every cotton pickin time.