CSK, I make general statements about socioeconomic status. I get attacked personally by numi and counterattack…numi attacks me…repeat. *bchadwick makes things clear, that’s the best summary*
bostonkev wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > BTW, why don’t you go pass Level 2 CFA? Isn’t that obvious? It’s because I don’t need it. I already got where I wanted to be without the exam. Your thinking that your professional career is defined by an exam reveals how little you know about the business. But again, for someone who hasn’t even passed Level I or any other finance exam, you sure like to talk.
numi Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > bostonkev wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > > BTW, why don’t you go pass Level 2 CFA? > > Isn’t that obvious? It’s because I don’t need it. And that was my point. comp_sci_kid…can you write a while loop for me and numi? I don’t think there are enough integers to count our back-and-forth ridiculousness. I am tired of this…I’ve had my entertainment.
topher Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > lol this thread is great. At least I made someone smile out of all this. 
People who don’t have pedigree but succeed anyway command a lot more respect in the real world than people who have it and succeeded at least in part because of it.
Couldn’t disagree more with that grossly generalistic statement.
I think schools do not matter as much in Canada. Anyone agree?
To get back to the original poster. I went to a crappy state school. I have a feeling my resume has been screened out of the bigger shops in town who recruit at the ivy schools, but that doesn’t bother me as much as it did. Plenty of opportunities for those who work hard at smaller shops. All a big brand name school does for you is get you the interview. It does not show indication of how hard you work. An example I can think of is a guy I met who got a near perfect on the LSAT exam back when I thought law school was for me. He said the LSAT is key to entering a good law school, but it doesn’t provide any indication of how hard you’ll work once you get there. Being he was the party type, it was a rude awakening real quick.
farley013 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Couldn’t disagree more with that grossly > generalistic statement. I think that the more generalized a statement, the better…in ALL cases. Why care about nuances when you have catch-all cases with a single generalized statement? Efficiency, efficiency, efficiency. Similarly, in any debate, it is much better to take a person’s nuanced views and throw them into very coarse-grained buckets…the bigger the buckets the better…why debate the fine points and the varied contexts when strawmen are so easy to set up and to burn and people are so easy to vilify? storko Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I think schools do not matter as much in Canada. > Anyone agree? Education is way overvalued and shouldn’t matter at all. I curse the day I started school. For example, I would be frolicking on the beaches instead of studying…stupid education.
farley013 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Couldn’t disagree more with that grossly > generalistic statement. I’m not surprised. I would too if I based my career on looking at where hedge fund managers went to school.
farley013 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- Add to the fact that as a fund of > funds manager I will not invest with a hedge fund > manager who does not have a strong pedigree, no > matter how good their returns are. That seems pretty crazy, all due respect to your success. University of Nebraska-Lincoln alum Warren Buffett says, “I don’t care where someone went to school, and that never caused me to hire anyone or buy a business” If people are really concerned about top schools, just read this old article from WSJ “Any college will do.” The University of Wisconsin has more Fortune 500 CEO’s than Harvard does. http://online.wsj.com/public/article/SB115853818747665842-w892WEqBwjUL4Ad9xKJiKz8ie0w_20070919.html?mod=tff_main_tff_top
And the University of Wisconsin has probably graduated a million more people than Harvard has, what’s your point? You could also say that the US prison system has more prisoners who graduated from Harvard than from a school that only has 100 students.
>I’m not surprised. I would too if I based my career on looking at where hedge fund >managers went to school. At least bostonkev backed up his far-fetched comments with tangible arguments. You are just plain ignorant. That is why I am where I am in my career and you are where you are.
so much poo flinging in this thread. you did this Joshua!!
I think one of the biggest risks in selecting a HF manager (or any manager) is the risk that the manager is too greedy and entitled. Greed and a sense of entitlement often lead to fraud. I would say this risk must be higher among the pedigreed. I would select the hungriest, smartest managers with the best character references, not the ones from the top schools.
farley013 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > And the University of Wisconsin has probably > graduated a million more people than Harvard has, > what’s your point? You could also say that the US > prison system has more prisoners who graduated > from Harvard than from a school that only has 100 > students. The point is that a smart person with drive and ambition can do whatever the hell they want if they really go after it and it doesn’t matter where they went to school. People who place themselves or others in a box based on where they spent a few years of their life need to broaden their perspectives.
>I think one of the biggest risks in selecting a HF manager (or any manager) is the risk >that the manager is too greedy and entitled. Greed and a sense of entitlement often >lead to fraud. I would say this risk must be higher among the pedigreed. I would select >the hungriest, smartest managers with the best character references, not the ones from >the top schools. This reminds me of an article I read about an elementary school investment club where the kids picked Pepsi because “everyone drinks Pepsi” and General Motors because “everyone drives a car.”
Nobody could pay me enough to do what you do. I think the funds of hedge funds business is basically a scam. Your clients are being duped in the worst way. I’m not sure how you can live with yourself.
You sound less and less educated with every post. Then again maybe that’s your goal.
farley013 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > >I think one of the biggest risks in selecting a > HF manager (or any manager) is the risk > >that the manager is too greedy and entitled. > Greed and a sense of entitlement often > >lead to fraud. I would say this risk must be > higher among the pedigreed. I would select > >the hungriest, smartest managers with the best > character references, not the ones from > >the top schools. > > This reminds me of an article I read about an > elementary school investment club where the kids > picked Pepsi because “everyone drinks Pepsi” and > General Motors because “everyone drives a car.” It’s scary that you claim to be a fund of funds manager and you don’t recognize this risk. Here is an article that suggests that pedigreed people are less likely to recognize ethical dilemmas. Bennett, Cambridge Graduate, to Join Jailed Ivy Alums (Update1) By Patricia Hurtado and David Voreacos July 3 (Bloomberg) – No matter which prison former Refco Inc. Chief Executive Officer Phillip Bennett serves the 16-year sentence he received today in Manhattan federal court, chances are he will be the only one there with a master’s degree from Cambridge University in England. The head of what was once the biggest independent U.S. futures broker, Bennett also was ordered to forfeit $2.4 billion in assets for what prosecutors said was among the very worst'' white-collar crimes. He faced a possible life sentence after pleading guilty to bank fraud and money laundering. Bennett, 60, joins at least a dozen other wealthy corporate executives with degrees from elite institutions such as Harvard University and the University of Pennsylvania's Wharton School who've been incarcerated for white-collar crimes this decade. Exceptional intelligence, self-confidence and feeling special, common among those educated at such schools, can turn into deviousness, arrogance and entitlement, said Tom Donaldson, a professor of ethics and law at Wharton in Philadelphia. If the devil exists, he no doubt has a high IQ and an Ivy League degree,’’ Donaldson said. It's clear that having an educational pedigree is no prophylactic against greed and bad behavior.'' Imprisoned executives with Ivy League degrees include Jeffrey Skilling, 54, former CEO of Enron Corp. (Harvard Business School); Timothy Rigas, 52, former chief financial officer of Adelphia Communications Corp. (Wharton); and William Sorin, 59, former general counsel of New York-based Comverse Technology Inc. (Harvard Law School). Elite Schools Some of these convicted executives have multiple degrees. Conrad Black, the former CEO of Chicago-based Hollinger International Inc., now serving a 6 1/2-year sentence for stealing $6.1 million from the company, has two bachelor's degrees from Carleton University, a master's degree from McGill University and a law degree from Laval University, all in Canada. There is a correlation between going to an elite school and ending up as a CEO,’’ said Edwin Hartman, a professor of business ethics at New York University’s Stern School of Business. Look at the list of the heads of the 400 elite companies. They certainly didn't go to no-name state schools.'' A top-level education may also cultivate arrogance, said Maurice Schweitzer, who teaches information management at Wharton. `They Feel Special' We tell our students at premier institutions that they are special, and they certainly feel special,’’ Schweitzer said. We have famous faculty and great resources. They are surrounded by accomplished peers, and recruiters flock to them.'' Massachusetts-based Harvard University spokeswoman Rebecca Rollins said the school didn't have an immediate comment. Wrongdoing in the executive suite is more about character flaws than alma maters, said Andrew Weissmann, a former federal prosecutor who led the U.S. Justice Department task force that investigated the collapse of Enron. Just because you went to a good school doesn’t mean you have a good moral compass,’’ Weissmann said. Moreover, some of the executives convicted since the Sarbanes-Oxley Act was passed in 2002 in response to corporate corruption didn’t attend elite schools. HealthSouth Corp. founder Richard Scrushy, 55, sentenced to almost 7 years in prison for bribery, has a bachelor’s degree from the University of Alabama in Birmingham. Former Tyco International Ltd. CEO L. Dennis Kozlowski, convicted of stealing $137 million from the company and in prison for 8 1/3 to 25 years, has a bachelor’s degree from Seton Hall University. Risk Takers Executives with top educations may end up trading their pin stripes for prison jumpsuits because they’re driven to excel. People who succeed in corporate America are risk-takers,'' said Anthony Barkow, a former federal prosecutor and Harvard Law School graduate who is now a New York University Law School professor. They’re smart, confident and sometimes even arrogant. That’s what it takes to succeed. Risk-takers get closer to the line and sometimes cross it.’’ Graduates from top-tier universities may feel so special, they think law doesn’t apply to them, Wharton’s Schweitzer said. We encourage our students to explore and think outside the box,'' Schweitzer said. In general, this approach is very constructive, but it may prompt people to be less likely to recognize an ethical dilemma.’’ Morgenthau’s Warning Current and former prosecutors who’ve handled white-collar cases said the defendants’ most common trait was avarice. It doesn't matter if you graduated from the best schools in the world and had every privilege accorded to you or not,'' said Campbell, a member of the Enron Task Force with degrees from Yale University and the University of Chicago School of Law. Greed is a strong motivation, and it can cause you to make mistakes.’’ Robert Morgenthau, the Manhattan District Attorney who is a graduate of Amherst College and Yale Law School, issued this warning: ``No matter what your position is in life or where you went to school, if you commit a crime in our jurisdiction, we’ll be happy to prosecute you.’’ To contact the reporters on this story: Patricia Hurtado in Brooklyn Federal Court at pathurtado@bloomberg.net; David Voreacos in Newark, New Jersey at dvoreacos@bloomberg.net