this has to be impossible. if we have all these regulations, then why do people die of being fat and drunk driving. there’s regulation against it so people can’t die from that bad stuff.
I suppose it’s a consistent position to say “No real change is required in response to Orlando. Sure, it sucks to be them, but these things don’t happen all that often, so why get upset about anything.”

You’re all wrong. None other than our next president, Hillary Rodham Clinton in April 2008 just before the PA primary. Barry took a similar view:
Q: Is the D.C. law prohibiting ownership of handguns consistent with an individual’s right to bear arms?
A: As a general principle, I believe that the Constitution confers an individual right to bear arms. But just because you have an individual right does not mean that the state or local government can’t constrain the exercise of that right, in the same way that we have a right to private property but local governments can establish zoning ordinances that determine how you can use it.
where does the us constitution say felons cant own guns, i thought everyone can own guns no?
Black_Swan:
Assault weapons are the least of all gun types used in murders and followed most closely by asphyxiation. But lets spend another few days equating assault weapons to America’s gun problem. The reality is that in a normal year, this event would equate to more than 20% of the US’s assault weapon deaths. Versus alcohol, tobacco, fatty foods, etc.
Alcohol, tobacco, and fatty foods are also regulated to some extent. You can’t buy alcohol unless you’re 21, if you’re bombed, and you can’t drive a car without proving you aren’t drunk if you’ve been caught boozing and cruising one too many times. Tobacco is 18+, trans-fats bans, soda bans, etc. I know I’m conflating federal and local regulations here, and I think this somewhat proves your point, but I’m just pointing out that anything that could cause potential harm to society can and should be regulated - obviously the extent of regulation can be debated to no end. Not selling arms to people on the no fly list is a pretty good start (somewhat analogous to not selling alcohol to a drunk person).
Assault weapons are largley regulated. But to my points above, I’m strongly in favor of more *good* regulation (particularly on the state or regional level). Not so much an outright ban though.

higgmond:
You’re all wrong. None other than our next president, Hillary Rodham Clinton in April 2008 just before the PA primary. Barry took a similar view:
Q: Is the D.C. law prohibiting ownership of handguns consistent with an individual’s right to bear arms?
A: As a general principle, I believe that the Constitution confers an individual right to bear arms. But just because you have an individual right does not mean that the state or local government can’t constrain the exercise of that right, in the same way that we have a right to private property but local governments can establish zoning ordinances that determine how you can use it.
where does the us constitution say felons cant own guns, i thought everyone can own guns no?
Most restrictions against felons are on a state by state basis. However felons lose the right to guns through federal law. They also lose the right to vote while incarcerated and the right to serve on juries thereafter.

king\_kong:Black_Swan:
Assault weapons are the least of all gun types used in murders and followed most closely by asphyxiation. But lets spend another few days equating assault weapons to America’s gun problem. The reality is that in a normal year, this event would equate to more than 20% of the US’s assault weapon deaths. Versus alcohol, tobacco, fatty foods, etc.
Alcohol, tobacco, and fatty foods are also regulated to some extent. You can’t buy alcohol unless you’re 21, if you’re bombed, and you can’t drive a car without proving you aren’t drunk if you’ve been caught boozing and cruising one too many times. Tobacco is 18+, trans-fats bans, soda bans, etc. I know I’m conflating federal and local regulations here, and I think this somewhat proves your point, but I’m just pointing out that anything that could cause potential harm to society can and should be regulated - obviously the extent of regulation can be debated to no end. Not selling arms to people on the no fly list is a pretty good start (somewhat analogous to not selling alcohol to a drunk person).
this has to be impossible. if we have all these regulations, then why do people die of being fat and drunk driving. there’s regulation against it so people can’t die from that bad stuff.
Clearly you don’t understand the concept of risk mitigation. We are a nation of 300+ million people, you can’t think in absolutes.
Do you really think alcohol related deaths would decrease if we got rid of age restrictions?
I’m sure several people a year die of erotic self-asphyxiation, but I wouldn’t argue for a ban on belts.

king\_kong:Black_Swan:
Assault weapons are the least of all gun types used in murders and followed most closely by asphyxiation. But lets spend another few days equating assault weapons to America’s gun problem. The reality is that in a normal year, this event would equate to more than 20% of the US’s assault weapon deaths. Versus alcohol, tobacco, fatty foods, etc.
Alcohol, tobacco, and fatty foods are also regulated to some extent. You can’t buy alcohol unless you’re 21, if you’re bombed, and you can’t drive a car without proving you aren’t drunk if you’ve been caught boozing and cruising one too many times. Tobacco is 18+, trans-fats bans, soda bans, etc. I know I’m conflating federal and local regulations here, and I think this somewhat proves your point, but I’m just pointing out that anything that could cause potential harm to society can and should be regulated - obviously the extent of regulation can be debated to no end. Not selling arms to people on the no fly list is a pretty good start (somewhat analogous to not selling alcohol to a drunk person).
Assault weapons are largley regulated. But to my points above, I’m strongly in favor of more *good* regulation (particularly on the state or regional level). Not so much an outright ban though.
whats “good” regulation? is that something that is good for you what if your neighbor think its bad for him, is it still good?

igor555:
higgmond:
You’re all wrong. None other than our next president, Hillary Rodham Clinton in April 2008 just before the PA primary. Barry took a similar view:
Q: Is the D.C. law prohibiting ownership of handguns consistent with an individual’s right to bear arms?
A: As a general principle, I believe that the Constitution confers an individual right to bear arms. But just because you have an individual right does not mean that the state or local government can’t constrain the exercise of that right, in the same way that we have a right to private property but local governments can establish zoning ordinances that determine how you can use it.
where does the us constitution say felons cant own guns, i thought everyone can own guns no?
Most restrictions against felons are on a state by state basis. However felons lose the right to guns through federal law. They also lose the right to vote while incarcerated and the right to serve on juries thereafter.
wth i thoght the founding fathers wanted everyone to own guns and have the right to vote.
thats bs man
Black_Swan:
Assault weapons are the least of all gun types used in murders and followed most closely by asphyxiation. But lets spend another few days equating assault weapons to America’s gun problem. The reality is that in a normal year, this event would equate to more than 20% of the US’s assault weapon deaths. Versus alcohol, tobacco, fatty foods, etc.
Alcohol, tobacco, and fatty foods are also regulated to some extent. You can’t buy alcohol unless you’re 21, if you’re bombed, and you can’t drive a car without proving you aren’t drunk if you’ve been caught boozing and cruising one too many times. Tobacco is 18+, trans-fats bans, soda bans, etc. I know I’m conflating federal and local regulations here, and I think this somewhat proves your point, but I’m just pointing out that anything that could cause potential harm to society can and should be regulated - obviously the extent of regulation can be debated to no end. Not selling arms to people on the no fly list is a pretty good start (somewhat analogous to not selling alcohol to a drunk person).
First, and foremost, alcohol, tobacco, driving, and fatty foods are a privilege, not a right. But, while we’re on the topic, you can’t purchase a handgun until you’re 21, you can’t purchase a long gun until you’re 18. Last time i checked, you aren’t subject to an FBI background check each time you try to buy one of these items. You’re not allowed to have firearms while intoxicated. So, there’s that…
As far as him being cleared to purchase the gun while on a no fly list, that’s the FBI’s own doing. They cleared him. They have the authority to hold/deny approval. That’s on them.

Black_Swan:
king\_kong:Black_Swan:
Assault weapons are the least of all gun types used in murders and followed most closely by asphyxiation. But lets spend another few days equating assault weapons to America’s gun problem. The reality is that in a normal year, this event would equate to more than 20% of the US’s assault weapon deaths. Versus alcohol, tobacco, fatty foods, etc.
Alcohol, tobacco, and fatty foods are also regulated to some extent. You can’t buy alcohol unless you’re 21, if you’re bombed, and you can’t drive a car without proving you aren’t drunk if you’ve been caught boozing and cruising one too many times. Tobacco is 18+, trans-fats bans, soda bans, etc. I know I’m conflating federal and local regulations here, and I think this somewhat proves your point, but I’m just pointing out that anything that could cause potential harm to society can and should be regulated - obviously the extent of regulation can be debated to no end. Not selling arms to people on the no fly list is a pretty good start (somewhat analogous to not selling alcohol to a drunk person).
Assault weapons are largley regulated. But to my points above, I’m strongly in favor of more *good* regulation (particularly on the state or regional level). Not so much an outright ban though.
whats “good” regulation? is that something that is good for you what if your neighbor think its bad for him, is it still good?
A few pages back I posted a framework basically forcing all transactions to occur through licensed dealers and heightening federal penalties for any unregulated gun transactions that would allow states (and cities) to pass prohibitive bans effectively as they saw fit. It’s worth reading, particularly so I won’t have to repeat myself. Most people largely seem to find it agreeable. This way gun laws can be more effectively tailored to the population being governed rather than sitting in a DC gridlock as rural and urban populations try to pass federal bans (or not) and take the other unwilling part of the population along for the ride. Or we can sit here and fight over a class of weapon that causes less than 250 deaths a year nationwide in a bill that will never pass on the federal level and would largely achieve nothing.
Since some of you are so proudly anti-gun, why don’t you all demonstrate your beliefs with your own home?
Go outside and post a flag/sticker/lawn sign stating that your house is a gun-free zone.
^Id rather infringe upon your freedoms.

^Id rather infringe upon your freedoms.
That’s exactly what the Nazis said to the Jews. Just like in the movie “Schindler’s List”.

Palantir:
^Id rather infringe upon your freedoms.
That’s exactly what the Nazis said to the Jews. Just like in the movie “Schindler’s List”.
That is the point, film Schindler’s List gives us the template for infringing your freedom. Precisely what I am advocating. Forcible seizure of gun ownership, and imprisonnent of those who resist.

Greenman72:
Palantir:
^Id rather infringe upon your freedoms.
That’s exactly what the Nazis said to the Jews. Just like in the movie “Schindler’s List”.
That is the point, film Schindler’s List gives us the template for infringing your freedom. Precisely what I am advocating. Forcible seizure of gun ownership, and imprisonnent of those who resist.
see now up until here you were doing a pretty job of trolling because i don’t think people could tell if you were serious.

Greenman72:
Palantir:
^Id rather infringe upon your freedoms.
That’s exactly what the Nazis said to the Jews. Just like in the movie “Schindler’s List”.
That is the point, film Schindler’s List gives us the template for infringing your freedom. Precisely what I am advocating. Forcible seizure of gun ownership, and imprisonnent of those who resist.
Thanks trollius maximus
not bad anony

Since some of you are so proudly anti-gun, why don’t you all demonstrate your beliefs with your own home?
Go outside and post a flag/sticker/lawn sign stating that your house is a gun-free zone.
Why can’t gun supporters just admit this is a hobby and not some kind of survival necessity. People on the other side would be more likely to sympathize with them. Arguing that somehow guns make people safer as a whole makes them seem crazy, making other people naturally oppose them.
2 words: zombie apocalypse