I was hoping for some recommendations from those with a stronger maths base to give me recommendations on next steps. In June, I should be done with the CFA program and I am looking at my next goal. I was originally contemplating MBA, but I don’t think my resume is strong enough at this point to get into a top 10 so I don’t think the cost is worth it. I also don’t want to quit my job so I am looking for something I can do part time. I have decided to go back to school and develop a base in mathematics. I have little experience and education in math. I graduated with Business Econ and Accounting. It has been almost 9 years since my last math classes which were differential and integral calculus my freshman year. I have never taken Linear algebra, ODE or PDE. My stat training isn’t much more rigorous than the CFA L2 curriculum. I dont know C, C++ or any other programing language. In other words, I have a lot to learn. I don’t expect to get into MFE at Haas but I would like to work toward something respectable that will help lead toward a more quantitative role, preferably fixed income PM down the line. Somehow, I need to learn: Differential Equations Linear Algebra Advanced Stat/Prob Multivariable Calc ODE/PDE Numerical Analysis Stochastic Calc My thought was take maybe 5-6 undergrad classes, knock out differential eq, stat/prob, and hope to get into a MA Math program to learn the rest. Do you think that is doable? If you were me what path would you take?
Look at the CQF --> it’ll be a grind, but it is doable
On the opposite end of the spectrum from the CQF, you can try the books from the Shaum’s series. Might be a good way to get your feet wet. http://www.amazon.com/Schaums-Outline-Advanced-Calculus-Third/dp/0071623663/ref=pd_sim_b_5
I have looked at CQF but I dont have the maths background for that either. Remember, business undergrad! I need to build a foundation first. I was thinking start with: 1. Self study refresher of Calc 1, 2 using Early Trancendentals 2. Take Multivar, differential equations, linear algebra and stat/prob at University of Illinois online. Also I prefer degree to certificate as I dont currently have a graduate level degree. Is this the best way to start my journey or is there another direction I should go? I’m a quick learner so I don’t want to spend time I don’t need to.
Also, what would it take to get into a respectable MFE from where I am now? Undergrad Bus Econ & Accounting CFA by next month 4 years Fixed Income Sales If I took some extension classes at UC Berkeley and Univ of Illinois in math would AdCom laugh at me?
^ I certainly wouldn’t laugh. It shows a desire to continue your education and drive.
DanLieb Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > ^ > I certainly wouldn’t laugh. It shows a desire to > continue your education and drive. But is it good enough? I fear not. I’m not sure the best path to take. What about a second bachelors in a quant discipline (CS, math, eng)? Waste of time?
What are your thoughts about doing a Graduate Certificate Program? I though this one from Columbia looked interesting. http://ce.columbia.edu/Postbaccalaureate-Studies/Quantitative-Studies-Finance-Certificate-Program
Nice contradiction - I give you a recommendation (which is doable, you don’t have to spend 3 years next to 19 year olds learning how to solve an integral of 1/x) and you say you’re not looking for a certificate program…then you ask for a recommendation on a different certificate program… BTW --> I was a business undergrad with no more than calc 1&2 --> I studied all recommended Shaum’s and I can keep up with the CQF - not a walk in the park, but definitely doable. Do you think anyone will care about a cert. program from Columbia? I can see a conversation: Columbia Grad: …back in the day when I graduated from Columbia. You: I also graduated from Finance program at Columbia Columbia Grad: Oh, so how did you find professor so-and-so? You: uh, I didn’t have him… Columbia Grad: But how? He still teaches that required course? You: I did the Quantitative certificate… Columbia Grad: oh…ummm…is that my phone? I gotta take this. You: … Cheers!
Keys Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Nice contradiction - I give you a recommendation > (which is doable, you don’t have to spend 3 years > next to 19 year olds learning how to solve an > integral of 1/x) and you say you’re not looking > for a certificate program…then you ask for a > recommendation on a different certificate > program… > > BTW --> I was a business undergrad with no more > than calc 1&2 --> I studied all recommended > Shaum’s and I can keep up with the CQF - not a > walk in the park, but definitely doable. > > Do you think anyone will care about a cert. > program from Columbia? I can see a conversation: > > Columbia Grad: …back in the day when I graduated > from Columbia. > > You: I also graduated from Finance program at > Columbia > > Columbia Grad: Oh, so how did you find professor > so-and-so? > > You: uh, I didn’t have him… > > Columbia Grad: But how? He still teaches that > required course? > > You: I did the Quantitative certificate… > > Columbia Grad: oh…ummm…is that my phone? I > gotta take this. > > You: … > > Cheers! I certainly wasn’t looking at the program for the “prestige”. It wouldn’t even go on a resume with the exception of a masters application. I looked at that because it seemed like a consolidated place to learn the basics to be able to pass the GRE math and get into a MFE. I look at the Columbia program as an alternative to self study in basic maths, not as an alternative to CFQ. I agree, CQF > Columbia but the Columbia doesn’t assume as much knowledge and looks like it might be easier given my lack of math training. The “Math Primer” I believe is geared toward those with BS in quant subjects like engineering that need a refresher, not someone that has never seen them before. So you learned math from the Shaum’s books? How long did that take? How many books did you do use? Can you learn all the way through PDEs and ODEs using that method?
Who was calling? Can’t the Columbian grad just call back, he’s in the middle of a conversation for crying out loud!
Good luck. I had to complete multi variate calc and linear algebra/diff equations in the same semester my senior year to prepare for the grad econ work. 5 days a week with tons of homework even with an econometrics and stat background. Math isnt something you can just learn, unlike an MBA or law where all undergrad degrees are eligible. Trying to build a base by yourself and competing with math grads will be a futile effort I can guarantee you. Good luck getting any grad math program to accept you without an undergrad in math or the hard sciences. CFA quant doesnt even scratch the surface of what you deal with in grad stats.
Good luck. I had to complete multi variate calc and linear algebra/diff equations in the same semester my senior year to prepare for the grad econ work. 5 days a week with tons of homework even with an econometrics and stat background. Math isnt something you can just learn, unlike an MBA or law where all undergrad degrees are eligible. Trying to build a base by yourself and competing with math grads will be a futile effort I can guarantee you. Good luck getting any grad math program to accept you without an undergrad in math or the hard sciences. CFA quant doesnt even scratch the surface of what you deal with in grad stats.
BizBanker Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Good luck. I had to complete multi variate calc > and linear algebra/diff equations in the same > semester my senior year to prepare for the grad > econ work. 5 days a week with tons of homework > even with an econometrics and stat background. > Math isnt something you can just learn, unlike an > MBA or law where all undergrad degrees are > eligible. Trying to build a base by yourself and > competing with math grads will be a futile effort > I can guarantee you. Good luck getting any grad > math program to accept you without an undergrad in > math or the hard sciences. CFA quant doesnt even > scratch the surface of what you deal with in grad > stats. Most of the programs I have looked at list the specific courses and skills they expect, such as linear algebra, advanced stats etc. Few have stated an undergrad in hard science is required, but some do. You really think I would have no shot without one? Thats disappointing. I was hoping maybe a quant certificate would be an acceptable proxy, given it covers the topics they usually require, linear algebra, ODE, PDE, prob and stats, C++. What do you think is my best options then? Second bachelors in math/engineering? That for some reason seems like a very backwards direction to go. Re-route to something softer like Masters in Quantitative Economics (too close to CFA?)
^^ You seem to be hung up on the Credential part of the education. I am saying that if you are going to apply it in real life no matter what you do, you are going to be competing with the best minds in math, especially in the financial world. A quant with a grad degree in stats or math is going to laugh at a “credential” much as many MBAs laugh at UoP. These programs are meant for people already in the field to gain extra expertise to keep up with the industry. Your post seems akin to someone saying “Hey all the sudden I have the urge to be a doctor.” Ok then you need to take O chem, bio, etc to do the MCATs just to get into med school. Math is a foundation skill, not a supplemental skill, thats why CFA quant is so easy compared to the actual quant involved in mathematical finance: so few in the popluation would have the basic foundation to even attempt the test. I am frankly surprised that there is no calc on the test when this is a prereq for most good business undergrads and insufficient for econ undergrads.
Most quants will laugh at a grad degree in stats or maths since they have Ph.Ds 
^^ Very true, can you imagine what they would say about a certificate?