Every once in a while, someone has the bring the forum down…today it’ll be me. On w/ the rant! I’m a L3 Candidate, and finding it impossible to pick up the books this relentless study cycle. For both levels 1 & 2, I hated the long hours in the library, but the motivation was always there. I was sure that the CFA designation would help in my future employment. It was a mark of distinction that would separate me from unwashed hordes of applicants from around the world. For those of you who follow where the CFA designation is most gathering steam, there is some delicious irony in my flawed thinking. Instead of dinners, vacations, and other enjoyable things that people who work hard and earning a decent living do; I spent my nights in the library. I sold this to my GF and later wife as putting off the instant gratification for longer term success…now, I’m not so sure that’s the case. I’m not saying the designation is w/out merit, only that in the current job market, the reward does not equal the effort. In discussing it w/ people in higher places than me, who in a mendacious manner always comment that they’re still working on Level 1 (yeah, right), I’m told how impressive it is, and how “smart I must be”; but dovetail those comments w/ the fact that there is a hiring freeze. I guess the lesson is, a CFA or MBA (insert meaningless letters) will not make you bulletproof or attractive in an industry like finance. Again, it’s great to be able to explain CDSs, CDOs, ABS, Swaps, Z tranches, Swaptions, and complex economic indicators to my colleagues in finance (who don’t seem to understand much of anything), but it would be nice to profit by it. When decided to embark upon this this 2.5 years ago, I read the same CFAI article that i’d bet 95% of us have…the CFAI Compensation Survey. Like many in finance, I salivated over those port. managers numbers (as did everyone from here to Bombay) and followed the herd into CFA bizarro world. This time around, I see the herd is all headed back to business school. Like the CFA was 3-5 years ago to those of us w/ a capable aptitude and ambition, an MBA has become the white whale, the panacea, and surefire road map to riches. While a great new set of initials to earn, I’ll leave the group think to the herd this time around. While the herd labors over six sigma black belts, and Michael Porters theories for the umpteenth time, (with visions of money plums dancing in your head) I’ll be sitting for my LSATs. [Flame suit engaged]
do what you like; like what you do. if the cfa isn’t what you like, don’t do it. the salary thing is a long term thing. you’re not going to be making $200K+ on the day that you get your charter. it is more important for you to be able to demonstrate the knowledge that you acquire in cfa in your work. the ultimate question - how much money can you make for the man? - will be the determinant in how much you make. you can do that with or without the cfa.
yeah i feel the same way and im only on level II! however i work with a few hundred finance professionals and the CFA is definitely a leg up. i can see how with experience, the salary can go up. Also, when you review the CFA compensation chart, they usually have it separated into years of experience. so CFA with 1 year experience may be 40-50K, but a CFA with over 10 years is well over 6 figures. its a highs risk designation with potentially high reward. i enjoy the material and have decided to tough it out in this industry as long as possible. good luck with the LSATs though. personally speaking, studying torts and laws and codes and litigation is mind numbingly boring to me. if you can do law school though, it would be a more prudent path to a higher salary imho.
I completed all 3 levels of the program and if I had to do it again, I would not go through it. The 1000+ hours I spent for the 3 levels would have been better used networking and reading the Economist, WSJ, FT, and even forums like this one. Today, I feel like I made a mistake. Maybe in 10 years I might change my mind when I see a payoff.
I still contend that the CFA is a great program, but the drawback is that it doesn’t give you an monopoly like a law degree, real estate, even securities license does. It doesn’t allow you to do something that you couldn’t do without it. More philosophically, education procides some tools, but it’s more important as to how use your education (or tools), life experiences, creativity to innovate and find your own niche. The older you get, the less it matters what educational background you have - because you will be judged on your results, not degrees or certs. A great salary is everyone’s goal, but remember that having a huge salary is not guaranteed happiness. I have known many very wealthy professionals who are not happy, or think that the appearance of wealth (i.e., mazaratti, huge houses, nice restaurants) will provide them happiness. Yet they seem empty and still shallow. Those objects will compliment fulfillment, but only if you found the work/life that makes you happy. Look for that before deciding what the next educational expedition is, not the other way around.
CFA is a scam. Just for all the hours and opportunity cost. Plus books, fee. Its not worth it. I never took any test or studied for it, but its good i realized this early and putting my efforts else where.
steveOW Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > CFA is a scam. Just for all the hours and > opportunity cost. Plus books, fee. Its not worth > it. I never took any test or studied for it, but > its good i realized this early and putting my > efforts else where. And where did the great steveOW put his efforts instead? Besides of course posting aimless crap on a CFA forum. I clearly see your point PeteyPete, in fact I think we went through all three levels together so far, so we’re in similar situations. The excitement isn’t there for me necessarily in the same form as a payoff seems unlikely, but I’m no less motivated. There comes a point where you have to do things in life simply for yourself and although finance would disagree (via sunk cost), there is clearly some merit to maintaining perseverence and finishing what you started. For me in particular, this program has been the single most transformative learning experience in my life (I came from a pretty low knowledge base), so that alone dwarfs any potential monetary payoff that I started this process for. Also, I learned that I have a quantative side which I’d never known before, and that alone was worth the whole endeavor. In addition, I gained a great professional and personal network through this process and it helped get me into a masters program where I proceded to do alright. I recommend you look at what you’ve gained already, and the more qualitative benefits. If you can’t find a similar list, maybe you should cut your losses at this point rather than operating strictly on sunk cost; if you can find a similar list, well then, enjoy another two months off, then I’ll see you on the forum.
Three other points PeteyPete, 1.) Impressive vocabulary 2.) > While a great new set of initials to earn, I’ll > leave the group think to the herd this time > around. While the herd labors over six sigma > black belts, and Michael Porters theories for the > umpteenth time, This is a great life lesson, and one I agree with regarding the stupid strategy catchphrases and conferences backed by paperback best sellers that periodically roll through the business world. 3.) > I’ll be sitting for my > LSATs. There are some very smart finance people I know of in law school right now, and it appears to momentarily be a good move. However, I have to point out, how is the quote regarding the LSATs (and presumably law school) any different from the designations in the two proceeding sentences. Law, like any field can be over run with supply, (people thought finance was immune to this as well). Just be careful, because in my honest opinion, I think that in 3-5 years law will certainly be the next field where the supply does actually outstrip demand and the monetary futures of lawyers will drastically decline. I believe I recall reading an article on law firms increasingly outsourcing legal work to the Phillipines due to the fact that they have a similar legal structure, so you may want to carefully analyze the future of the industry. Just my thoughts.
Black Swan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > certainly be the next field where the supply does > actually outstrip demand and the monetary futures > of lawyers will drastically decline. I believe I > recall reading an article on law firms > increasingly outsourcing legal work to the > Phillipines due to the fact that they have a > similar legal structure, so you may want to > carefully analyze the future of the industry. > Just my thoughts. You couldn’t be more right. The supply of lawyers ALREADY outstrips the demand and with these new ABA schools popping up everywhere it’s only going to get worse. The top jobs go to graduates of the top schools and even lately that isn’t always the case. Law is definitely not at easy street to lots of money.
Agree with SteelyDan. Unlike MBA programs, where you can go to a lower tier school and still get a decent job, if you don’t go to a top law school, you probably wont even be able to meet your debt service coverage payments. See article below: http://online.wsj.com/public/article/SB119040786780835602.html
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23320 I almost went to law school. These forums were helpful in getting the actual picture.
I find it effortless to study the CFA curriculum. My only regret is not having known about finance earlier. Combine this with research for active trading, and I feel like I’m a kid at a candy store every single day when I wake up.
sublimity Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I find it effortless to study the CFA curriculum. > My only regret is not having known about finance > earlier. Combine this with research for active > trading, and I feel like I’m a kid at a candy > store every single day when I wake up. Nice one sublimity. I like your attitude 
Behind the often hostile tone of my posts (some are just for laughs like when I call people assclowns, lol), I really feel lucky, happy, and optimistic since I find the finance/trading material so intellectually stimulating and it feels like the ultimate video game. As Mihalyi Cszikszentmihalyi says says it in his book, I get in total “flow.”
More focused than ever. One more test to go.
Professions and work Developers of computer software reference getting into a flow state when developing in an undistracted state. [9] Stock market operators often use the term “in the pipe” to describe the psychological state of flow when trading during high volume days and market corrections.
If the challenges are more than the ability, you get anxious. If the challenges are less than ability, you get bored. If the challenges match ability, you are in flow (aka: heaven, happiness, etc.)
*if the perception of the challenge
Well, that too, but think of the following situations in which it isn’t just the “perception”: - multi-tabling 12 tables of online poker simultaneously - playing the piano/guitar - juggling 8 balls - playing a person in tennis - snowboarding/skiing down a mountain - playing JoeyDVivre in Halo 3 Surely, this is more than just the perception - you genuinely have some amount of ability to match the challenges.
i beat jdv multiple times in halo 3