So I am very young and yes i have a lot to lear… i thought i should put it out there before all of you oldies start commenting … So I have been working at one of the big five banks in Canada for 2 years (on and off) as a commercial banker co-op. My director is very stingy and loves being under hid budget specially when it comes to salary and what not. Till now he has been underpaying me (compared to some market rates I found on the Bank website) and using the excuse that I am co-op student. Now he is in the process of preparing an offer for me (full time), and I have a feeling that he is going to use the “Recession” Excuse to f@ck me over again, even thought in Canada things getting better and some economist are even sayin we are in the recovery stage. So since i do have a LOT TO LEARN, can you guys give me some pointers of how i can pin this guy down in order to try and get what i deserve! GO!!!
Tough market right now, that is true. But ya, I know these types, they want to low ball all their employees so they can show how much they are saving the company and get big fat pay themselves. Then everyone quits or they just have sucky loser employees. Usually the only way is to get an outside offer and jet, and you need to do so before you find yourself making 50% less than market, cause that is a big hole to climb out.
Point out the fact that the Canadian banking is fundamentally sound and arguably in the best shape in the world (that is what my bank told me) I would start looking at other places if I were you. I understand the challenges we face right now but I hate dealing with f*@(ers who nickel and dime their employees.
^^well he is pretty smart on that end he knows that all banks, atleast in Canada, start hiring new grads in September, to begin work in January. So he is trying to prepare an offer for next week, so that he can corner me before I even get a chance to apply elsewhere. Maybe I should take chances and not accept the offer??? and wait until other banks open up recruiting in September, with two years of experience, CFA Level 1 passed, i think i should have a pretty good advantage over other new graduates???
$tarving_Banker Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Point out the fact that the Canadian banking is > fundamentally sound and arguably in the best shape > in the world (that is what my bank told me) > I would start looking at other places if I were > you. I understand the challenges we face right now > but I hate dealing with f*@(ers who nickel and > dime their employees. I am actually very interested in looking elsewhere, just becuase of this reason. Here’s another thing I was thinking of, I get the best possible offer I can out of him, accept it, but still look for other jobs. If I find one I can simply tell him to f off, the contract usually says, “either party can terminate contract with two weeks notice”. Any comments on that? Is it too duochebag’ish of me to do that?
purealpha Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > But ya, I know these types, they want to low ball > all their employees so they can show how much they > are saving the company and get big fat pay > themselves. Then everyone quits or they just have > sucky loser employees. Sounds like my previous employer.
prove that you are worth more by shoving another offer in his face
^read the fourth post from top
I would say just tell him what you think. If he is not receptive then he basically doesn’t care about your future or career and you would be f’d working there anyway. You could take the job and then just send out tons of resumes, use your paid vacation for interviews and leave after a couple months.
I’m in a similar position, I’m under my market value at current employer, and we have such strict policies about raises and promotions I don’t think they could give me the bump I’m looking for. They really want me to stay and have told me I can do whatever I want at the firm, and make my own career trajectory or whatever. But if they can’t pony up the money I would be crazy to stay, it’s just not an option. Like others have said, you don’t want to find yourself well below market after a few years because it will be hard to bridge that gap without jumping to a new firm.
So I should be the douchebag, accept the offer and keep looking for other, if I find it good, otherwise stick this one out as long as possible!!!
Do you enjoy commercial banking that much? How is the rest of your resume? Grades? Have you started networking? You would be crazy to just take a commercial gig with your background, I know a guy who took a commercial banking and a trading internship (4months each) on his resume at a weaker school. To land interviews with all the capital markets groups of the big5. He ended up in corporate debt at one of the big5. As for accepting, reneging. That may wreck your chances of getting into research/trading/banking at that particular big5 for the next 2 years or so.
adehbone Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Do you enjoy commercial banking that much? How is > the rest of your resume? Grades? > > Have you started networking? You would be crazy to > just take a commercial gig with your background, I > know a guy who took a commercial banking and a > trading internship (4months each) on his resume at > a weaker school. To land interviews with all the > capital markets groups of the big5. He ended up in > corporate debt at one of the big5. > > As for accepting, reneging. That may wreck your > chances of getting into research/trading/banking > at that particular big5 for the next 2 years or > so. well my resume is pretty strong, i think atleast, considering my age and education (fourth year BBA). I have worked at the same bank for 2 years, also worked part time. As for grades, been on deans honour list every year (over 80% average), inducted into Beta Gamma Sigma (search on google if you dont know) As for networking, just through the different co-op placements, so in essence a lot of commercial bankers. I have no clue of what IB would be like, but I wouldnt mind corporate debt, can you suggest how I can get into it? or even if i wanted to make the transition into IB you think it would be difficult?
anyone else got anything else for me???
What do you want - really? You don’t even say what you would be doing. Would you be generating revenue? Would you be a cost center? Are you replaceable? Do you have any other offers? Don’t think that just because your resume is strong, that you are entitled to higher compensation.
Google negotiating a pay rise. You will get a lot more useful information than here. Look at things like win win techniques, walk away position, keeping things positive. It’s a tough time. Example of the above: win-win. Your boss has budget constraints, you want more money. Say to your boss, I understand it is a difficult time for everyone at the moment. However, if I do XYZ then will you give me a pay rise by a certain date e.g. 3/6 months to bring me up to parity. That is an example of the if-then approach. You have to show why you are worth it and explain it factually. The market rate for this position is XYZ based on research by yadda yadda. Dont shove a counter offer down their throat. Say how much you enjoy the work and being part of the team. You want to leverage a good relationship with him down the line. Let one of the other greens use a confrontational approach and blow up on themselves. Do you even know how much you are being underpaid? Use cold hard facts, not hearsay. Are you being underpaid for exactly the same position? Same years experience, technical skills? If yes, you have a case. As I say, there is plenty of stuff out there, explained a lot better than I could communicate. Negotiation is an art.