Why wasn’t the media instead of hyping this up not getting information out about counter protests? You would think a massive counter protest would send a much stronger signal than having him just call it off.
This story is so odd. How can this ‘pastor’ call himself a Christian and then go about acting in a way that is just the polar opposite to the Christian ethos. Do unto others as you would like done to you indeed. His church seems to be called the ‘Dove World Outreach Center’. Surely he could not have selected a more ironic name for someone who stokes up religious tensions and hatred (dove?) and then clearly has no interested in reaching out to any part or peoples of the world that do not subscribe to his exceptionally narrow world view. I’m not sure if the guy is stupid or malevolent, but clearly has learned nothing from history if he thinks that continuing to fight the crusades/jihad is a good idea.
Carson Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > This story is so odd. How can this ‘pastor’ call > himself a Christian and then go about acting in a > way that is just the polar opposite to the > Christian ethos. Do unto others as you would like > done to you indeed. > Ok I wasn’t going to comment but this is getting ridiculous. History has shown Christianity is without a doubt one of the most violent religions. Christian men throughout history have used the will of God (just like some Islamic extremists) to commit acts of mass murder or destruction. So before you go and criticize the pastor for being “un-Christian”, there’s no defined behavior for being “Christian” People choose to believe what they wish and then some take it further by acting on it. He is part of the latter, and has the right to burn a certain book. He can burn the quran, just as muslims can burn the american flag.
iteracom Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Carson Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > This story is so odd. How can this ‘pastor’ > call > > himself a Christian and then go about acting in > a > > way that is just the polar opposite to the > > Christian ethos. Do unto others as you would > like > > done to you indeed. > > > > > Ok I wasn’t going to comment but this is getting > ridiculous. History has shown Christianity is > without a doubt one of the most violent religions. > Christian men throughout history have used the > will of God (just like some Islamic extremists) to > commit acts of mass murder or destruction. So > before you go and criticize the pastor for being > “un-Christian”, there’s no defined behavior for > being “Christian” > > People choose to believe what they wish and then > some take it further by acting on it. He is part > of the latter, and has the right to burn a certain > book. He can burn the quran, just as muslims can > burn the american flag. Well I think it’s fair to say that Christian behaviour is defined by Jesus’s teachings in the new testament. Of course they are very much open to interpretation. Jesus’s parables are often extremely complex and cryptic in their meaning. He also never spoke explicitly about any major social issue other than divorce (which he opposed). His main message was to treat others like you would like to be treated (so a big fail to the pastor on that front). Also Jesus was very keen on not judging people (associated with prostitues, lepers etc) and on giving all your possessions to charity. While his teachings are not always fully clear in their meaning, I think there is a quite strong message there to be respectful and considerate to other people.
An update on this thread from today. Apparently the pastor bravely burned a copy of the Koran on March 20… and probably went back home to see how it was portayed on local TV news. Of course, this jacka@@ doesn’t suffer the consequences of such provocation… NY Times April 1, 2011 Afghan Mob Kills 10 United Nations Workers By ROD NORDLAND KABUL, Afghanistan — Protesters angered by the burning of a Koran by a fringe American pastor in Florida mobbed offices of the United Nations in northern Afghanistan on Friday, killing ten foreign staff members and beheading two of the victims, according to an Afghan police spokesman. Five Afghans were also killed. The attack began when hundreds of demonstrators, some of them armed, poured out of mosques after Friday Prayer and headed to the headquarters of the United Nations in the northern city of Mazar-i-Sharif. They disarmed the guards and overran the compound, according to Lal Mohammad Ahmadzai, spokesman for Gen. Daoud Daoud, the Afghan National Police commander for northern Afghanistan. A spokesman for the United Nations Assistance Mission in Afghanistan, Kieran Dwyer, said the attack had occurred during a demonstration. “We can confirm there have been casualties, including U.N. personnel, but the situation on the ground remains very confusing,” he said. He added that Staffan de Mistura, the chief of the United Nations mission in Afghanistan, was en route to Mazar-i-Sharif. Tolo TV news in Kabul reported that the head of the United Nations mission in the city was among the victims, but that could not be confirmed. Mirwais Zabi, director of the public health hospital in Mazar-i-Sharif, said 24 wounded Afghan civilians and five dead Afghan civilians were brought to the hospital, with more wounded expected. Other reports said that the Afghan dead included some of the guards. Mr. Ahmadzai, the police spokesman, said the crowd was angry about the burning of the Koran by Pastor Terry Jones on Mar. 20. Mr. Jones had caused an international uproar by threatening to burn the Koran last Sept. 11, and demonstrations at the time led to deaths throughout Afghanistan, but on a small scale. Mr. Jones subsequently had publicly promised not to burn a Koran, but then went ahead last month, after holding a mock trial of the Koran at his fringe church in Gainesville, Fla. After disarming the United Nations compound’s guards, the crowd surged inside. Eight of the foreign staffers, whose nationalities were not known immediately, were killed by gunfire, and two others were captured and then beheaded, Mr. Ahmadzai said. He added that 15 people had so far been arrested for their part in the attack, and that the Afghan authorities had brought the situation under control. Elsewhere in Afghanistan, six American soldiers have been killed in a single operation in eastern Afghanistan on Wednesday and Thursday, a spokesman for the international coalition said Friday. “I can confirm that six coalition soldiers have been identified as US soldiers, and were all killed as part of the same operation, but in three separate incidents,” said Maj. Tim James. The operation, a helicopter-borne assault into a remote part of Kunar Province close to the Pakistani border, was ongoing. The area is frequently used to infiltrate fighters from Pakistan. The purpose of the operation, Major James said, was to “disrupt insurgent operations.” The governor of Kunar Province, Said Fazlullah Wahidi, said the operation began Wednesday as a joint Afghan and American air and ground operation in the districts of Sarkani and Marawara, close to the border of Pakistan. He said that 14 insurgents were killed and 10 wounded, but had no information about Afghan government casualties.
>>Of course, this jacka@@ doesn’t suffer the consequences of such provocation… Is death the proper consequence for burning a book?
I’m sorry, but I can’t really be mad at the pastor here for refusing to sacrifice the right to free speech in the face of fanatical threats. I mean, I could care less about Korans and Bibles and all this junk. But you know what I do care about, our freedom that our country and so many of our predecessors have sacrificed to uphold, including lives given for free speech. And I find something deeply offensive about some illiterate sand haji halfway around the world in a hut with 3 goats and a stick of TNT trying to strip that right from the American people. I refuse to let a bunch of animals that would kill and BEHEAD 10 UN workers who were unrelated to the event but there solely to help those pigs define our rights. I cannot understand why we help these animals. They say people have the government they deserve. I believe this explains the dictators in the middle east. Time to get the troops out and dust off the nukes, see how many of them still work.
Black Swan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > some illiterate sand haji > halfway around the world in a hut with 3 goats and > a stick of TNT lol
Black Swan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > some illiterate sand haji > halfway around the world in a hut with 3 goats and > a stick of TNT trying to strip that right from the > American people. Come on now don’t get carried away, we’re talking about 2 goat haji’s at best here.
now if these guys reacted that way over something meaningful, like a game of football or cricket, i’d understand
Black Swan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I’m sorry, but I can’t really be mad at the pastor > here for refusing to sacrifice the right to free > speech in the face of fanatical threats. I mean, > I could care less about Korans and Bibles and all > this junk. But you know what I do care about, our > freedom that our country and so many of our > predecessors have sacrificed to uphold, including > lives given for free speech. And I find something > deeply offensive about some illiterate sand haji > halfway around the world in a hut with 3 goats and > a stick of TNT trying to strip that right from the > American people. I refuse to let a bunch of > animals that would kill and BEHEAD 10 UN workers > who were unrelated to the event but there solely > to help those pigs define our rights. I cannot > understand why we help these animals. They say > people have the government they deserve. I > believe this explains the dictators in the middle > east. > > Time to get the troops out and dust off the nukes, > see how many of them still work. Lol. +10
Black Swan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I’m sorry, but I can’t really be mad at the pastor > here for refusing to sacrifice the right to free > speech in the face of fanatical threats. I mean, > I could care less about Korans and Bibles and all > this junk. But you know what I do care about, our > freedom that our country and so many of our > predecessors have sacrificed to uphold, including > lives given for free speech. And I find something > deeply offensive about some illiterate sand haji > halfway around the world in a hut with 3 goats and > a stick of TNT trying to strip that right from the > American people. I refuse to let a bunch of > animals that would kill and BEHEAD 10 UN workers > who were unrelated to the event but there solely > to help those pigs define our rights. I cannot > understand why we help these animals. They say > people have the government they deserve. I > believe this explains the dictators in the middle > east. > > Time to get the troops out and dust off the nukes, > see how many of them still work. +1 
I am muslim and I almost do not mind the buring of the Quran… Yes to me it is the word of god, but just cause “you” decided to burn it does not meen a thing… At the end all you are doing is burning A5 paper and looking like a fool… You wana hate on muslims, come try to kills us, or fire us from our jobs, not that I want that, but at least your trying to do something about it…you are not gona stop us by burning a book
The Muslim extremists would love to have a Christian burn the Quran. It would make their recruitment easier.
gulfcfa Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I am muslim and I almost do not mind the buring of > the Quran… > > Yes to me it is the word of god, but just cause > “you” decided to burn it does not meen a thing… > > At the end all you are doing is burning A5 paper > and looking like a fool… > > You wana hate on muslims, come try to kills us, or > fire us from our jobs, not that I want that, but > at least your trying to do something about > it…you are not gona stop us by burning a book I don’t think any of us on AF or Americans in general hate Muslims simply because they are Muslims. I certainly don’t hate Muslims, it’s a non-issue for me that someone is Muslim. We just hate the violent extremists that are threatening our values, mostly by the news we read all the time, and they tend to be Muslim extremists. That said, I can definitely see the point of view of those in Muslim lands who see, for example, Predator drones that kill innocent kids. Obviously, moderate Muslims and the rest of the non-Muslim world are on the same side against the extremists.
sublimity Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > gulfcfa Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > I am muslim and I almost do not mind the buring > of > > the Quran… > > > > Yes to me it is the word of god, but just cause > > “you” decided to burn it does not meen a > thing… > > > > At the end all you are doing is burning A5 > paper > > and looking like a fool… > > > > You wana hate on muslims, come try to kills us, > or > > fire us from our jobs, not that I want that, > but > > at least your trying to do something about > > it…you are not gona stop us by burning a book > > I don’t think any of us on AF or Americans in > general hate Muslims simply because they are > Muslims. I certainly don’t hate Muslims, it’s a > non-issue for me that someone is Muslim. > > We just hate the violent extremists that are > threatening our values, mostly by the news we read > all the time, and they tend to be Muslim > extremists. > > That said, I can definitely see the point of view > of those in Muslim lands who see, for example, > Predator drones that kill innocent kids. > > Obviously, moderate Muslims and the rest of the > non-Muslim world are on the same side against the > extremists. Agreed. No hate here just because someone is a Muslim. What gets me irritated is constant denial of the issue and hypocrisy on one side and the witch-hunt on the other.
Isn’t Muslim reaction a response to American foreign policy in the region since Eisenhower? Maybe if there wasn’t unconditional support to a particular country in the region that can apparently do no wrong, more people wouldn’t have to resort to violence. It’s time to be a true broker in the region or get out. Picking a side has been a bad strategy for decades now.
Which country?! The one that starts with I? And by that I don’t mean Iran or Iraq, lol. Anyways, point taken former trader. No one cries when many Palestinian children get killed by shrapnel, since he/she is only collateral damage.
In the country starting with A groups of kids were bombed. And the country starting with I was not the one who did it. But the target was wrong. They mixed UN with U… What the hell was the second letter??
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2010/09/201091112152289695.html General David Petraeus, the US commander in Afghanistan, warned that burning the Quran could endanger the lives of US troops who might become the target of retribution. But why do Obama and Petraeus think that burning the Quran is any less civilised or more dangerous than their use of unmanned drones to target suspected Taliban or al-Qaeda fighters and the subsequent civilian casualties these attacks often entail?