Why don’t you develop Ohai’s Divorce Probability Index?
Note: I get a 1% perpetual royalty on the name.
I’m not sure a good career or education really comes into it. It’s more about finding a partner you like and respect (as opposed to love/lust over). Love and lust are much more powerful emotions than like and respect but they can be fleeting. If there is no mutual respect, then I don’t see how a marriage can work long term.
I can try, but it might not make much sense unless you know me well. I’m a bit of an oddity on a forum such as this: I am at my core a romantic / hopeless poet who majored in English. I just happen to be good at math and have an interest in finance.
We got married in March 2007 and the first few months of marriage were great, very cozy. That fall, she transitioned from a graduate school program into a rather stressful job. Soon thereafter, we started searching for our first home. Stresses piled up, and this led to a change in various respects. She became rather critical and biting in her communication with me, and I didn’t respond well to this. This kind of communication tends to make me shut down and withdraw, which is an emotional reaction that some describe as “stonewalling.” (And later I realized this reaction can be traced to a communication pattern that was common with - of course! - my father.) Anyway, a few weeks after we moved into our new place, I decided we needed to have a talk about this, and I told her that the criticism and occasional outright contempt really bothered me. And her response was that these were just superficial issues and that the underlying relationship was what we needed to work on. To some extent, that was true, but criticism and contempt are in no way superficial issues, because they dramatically affected how I felt about her and the relationship. Anyway, I was rather speechless about all this, again, because I was shutting down. She is very smart, doesn’t pull any punches, and would rather see the planet explode than admit she was wrong about anything.
In the years after that, we had some good times, some bad times, had a kid, and then things really started hitting the fan. The conversation above is so little league compared to what came later. The kinds of conversations when you close your eyes and insist to yourself that what you’re hearing is just a dream. There was no saving the marriage, and the day she moved out I felt so much better. From the experience, I learned that I need with be with someone who is very kind. A good amount of natural energy would be good too. Still working on finding that person, but I’ve enjoyed the heck out of the past two years.
Hey, be nice!
^ Sorry, not meant as a mean remark. It honestly does sound like something Joe Cordell would say in one of commercials though. Unless you live in Missorah or Illinois though, Joe’s not licensed in your state, but his attorneys in your state are.
While mutual respect is crucial, I still think certain level of lust/desire is also necessary or you’ll end up in sexless marriage.
I was joking - never saw the commercial. I take its not a good sign sound like a divorce lawyer. Ouch /
Yeah sorry. I didn’t mean to imply otherwise.
I guess I was thinking you have to be in love/lust to get engaged in the first place so they are prerequisites. If you don’t also have like/respect then it won’t last.
And even though that might seem obvious, it’s amazing how many couples you see who don’t seem to actually like or respect each other all that much!
Ahh. Gotcha
1.5 years and counting. Biggest investment (myself) that I have made, seems like ROI is better than expected.
Btw, I saw Louis CK’s show the other day, and it went something like this.
"When I got married, I thought, oh I can’t leave now, not that I was thinking about leaving, but I can’t leave now. And when I got my kid, I was like, oh I could have left, I COULD HAVE LEFT! "
Any thoughts to this statement?LOL
In terms of ease of separation, it goes something like this in my opinion (easiest to hardest):
married -> jointly owned pet -> jointly owned property -> child.
So if you are married, renting, no pets and no kids then it is very easy to separate. Logistically that is, not necessarily emotionally!
But external factors influence how much you like or respect your spouse. For example, long term unemployed people are more likely to be divorced. If your spouse is unable to find work, perhaps your respect for them will decline over time. If the family is under financial stress, the members will probably behave in a less likable manner. “Like and respect” are a function of environment, as well as personality.
Good careers and education contribute to financial stability, and this contributes to happiness. Perhaps you misinterpreted this point. As an extra point, people with good education are probably more likely to come from stable families themselves. If they had non-divorced role models while growing up, perhaps they will also be less likely to become divorced.
Continuing along the lines of “like and respect” (which I argued are dependent on other factors), different people will have different thresholds for these factors before divorce becomes likely. These thresholds might depend on upbringing, personality, or culture. Hispanic people, for instance, are less likely than white people to divorce. Strong family values are probably a component of this, rather than that they just “like” each other more.
10 months!
I agree 100%. My parents divorced. They are now both substantially worse off in almost every possible way.
12Y7m Long position
The source/motivations of that desire change over time. If you work hard at the marriage, you’ll stay intimate. Sexless marriages IMO are symbolic of other issues.
ditto.
i find that this is the key to my own relationship, and i would assume it is for others. things go much better once both of you start admitting you were wrong, soon into the disagreement/fight. even if its borderline, admit you were wrong and move on and even if your SO is mostly wrong, still admit your part in drama (i.e. apologize for getting mad or being disrespectful when she is blatantly wrong). if you both do this, it is likely things won’t get out of control. fighting about who was right and wrong is likely the start of the dissolution of marriage.
There’s a saying that goes something like this:
Men get married hoping that the woman will never change. Women get married hoping that the man will change. Both are inevitably disappointed.