I’ve never even heard of the CIIA. I guess it’s only a European thing. This article debates the global relevance of the letters after your name. http://www.funds-europe.com/January-2005/Investment-education-the-qualification-showdown-/menu-id-228.html
i don’t think it matters much. the truth is, anybody that is capable should be able to get those designations with just a bit of stress. CAIA is jsut a rip off.
I think the world does need a universal standard and it seems to be leaning towards the CFA
“older chaps”… LOL!!!
FrankArabia Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > i don’t think it matters much. the truth is, > anybody that is capable should be able to get > those designations with just a bit of stress. > > CAIA is jsut a rip off. Depends on how you define rip off. For me, it was no rip off at all, it was paid for by my company, and provided me with a vast amount of knowledge on alternatives that was not provided in the CFA program. It set me apart from my counterparts. It really digs into due diligence. If you are calling it a rip off because it is not very recognizable and will not land you a job, based solely on the letters, then I would agree.
i’m calling it a rip off cause it cost so damm much for the exam. I already read some of the stuff in the L2 cirriculum. I agree, the knowledge is worth it. definitely good stuff. I just don’t want to pay for a designation that has very limited value at the moment. Plus the fact the first level exam was a joke, which suggests to me that this exam won’t garner the value you would want. If they made the exam very difficult, then yes, doing the second level would be a challenge worth conquering. but if everybody can get it easily, no value at all.
FrankArabia Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > i’m calling it a rip off cause it cost so damm > much for the exam. > > I already read some of the stuff in the L2 > cirriculum. > > I agree, the knowledge is worth it. definitely > good stuff. > > I just don’t want to pay for a designation that > has very limited value at the moment. Plus the > fact the first level exam was a joke, which > suggests to me that this exam won’t garner the > value you would want. If they made the exam very > difficult, then yes, doing the second level would > be a challenge worth conquering. but if everybody > can get it easily, no value at all. are you serious !!!
If daj were here, he’d say, “Need all 3, last time I say it.”
The CFA is a ripoff, the others are even more of a ripoff. When I think about it these days, I can’t believe I spent a good part of 18 months studying for this piece of crap designation. It doesn’t help me at all with what I do. The econ / finance / accounting stuff is a joke compared to real world practice. Really, CFA? All current vs. temporal method? WOW! So useful! How about something I can actually use, like detecting fraud or handicapping bankruptcy probability? And don’t even get me started on the useless derivatives and risk management stuff they put in there. I guess I can’t complain too much though since the CFA was a major factor in getting my current job, but damn, that 18 months would have been better spent learning a useful skillset… or pretty much anything else other than studying for the CFA. Maybe I am the only one that feels this way…
what is that pretty much anything else may I ask? maybe I should go do that instead.
yes I’m serious that CAIA is a rip off cause its not hard enough. things are valuable when there is little supply. easy exams means abundant supply easily. what’s the point of having hte CAIA when everybody can easily get it? *I predict that one day the CAIA will be important and when i take it, i will fail. * I disagree Bromion. i felt the knowledge taught in the CFA program was superb and it teaches ppl without a strong background the basics so they can move on to the subject of their choice comfortably. Yes, i agree it isn’t deep enough. This is why I am doing Level 4. I think they should make a Level 4 where you get to choose the subject of your choice. you have accounting, derivatives, mathematical finance, etc. I really dont’ want to learn the proofs for those options models, or learn about swaps, etc.
billwest Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > what is that pretty much anything else may I ask? > maybe I should go do that instead. Well, if you have a career focus, you could put more hours in at work or studying things that are relevant to your job. If you have a non-career focus, you choose – anything from spending time with your famliy, to working out, to hobbies, to chasing women.
true, but the marginal return of 2 more hours of work may be minimal. your brain kinda shuts off after working continuous 16 hour days. i agree with you on the non-career stuff though. having/starting a family is be more worthwhile than passing an exam. bromion Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > billwest Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > what is that pretty much anything else may I > ask? > > maybe I should go do that instead. > > Well, if you have a career focus, you could put > more hours in at work or studying things that are > relevant to your job. If you have a non-career > focus, you choose – anything from spending time > with your famliy, to working out, to hobbies, to > chasing women.
Wow chill on the CFA bashing. To contrast FrankArabia, I kind of like that I get a little taste of all the different aspects of Finance. I’m able to draw parallels with what I do day to day with the CFA curriculum and not to mention it is nice to be somewhat clued in when some mentions something you’ve at least seen before (if not mastered). I think it’s a great utility belt to have. Will I ever need to correct and AR(3) model with a unit root with first differencing? Probably not. I think it just ties a lot of the things your read and hear together so you can get a grasp of the bigger picture. I would encourage anybody interested in finance to pursue the CFA purely from a point of the pursuit of knowledge for knowledge’s sake rather than the expected payoff of landing a hot shot PM job. You’ll probably be let down. Just my thoughts…
fxguy1234 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I would encourage anybody interested in finance to > pursue the CFA purely from a point of the pursuit > of knowledge for knowledge’s sake rather than the > expected payoff of landing a hot shot PM job. > You’ll probably be let down. Knowledge is great. But why focus on arcane things that very few people actually use for anything? It would be like reading about race cars for 18 months without ever driving the car.You could calculate the physics of the car under different scenarios, talk about what kind of tires are best for certain tracks and weather conditions, etc., but when you actually sat down in the car, you wouldn’t even know how to turn it on. That probably sounds like an extreme example, but that is the level of HUGE holes that the CFA leaves in your knowledge base (assuming no prior background). They leave out the most basic and useful things in favor of the most arcane and useless things. It’s not even about getting a hotshot job, it’s about feeling like it was time well spent.
bromion Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > fxguy1234 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > I would encourage anybody interested in finance > to > > pursue the CFA purely from a point of the > pursuit > > of knowledge for knowledge’s sake rather than > the > > expected payoff of landing a hot shot PM job. > > You’ll probably be let down. > > Knowledge is great. But why focus on arcane things > that very few people actually use for anything? It > would be like reading about race cars for 18 > months without ever driving the car.You could > calculate the physics of the car under different > scenarios, talk about what kind of tires are best > for certain tracks and weather conditions, etc., > but when you actually sat down in the car, you > wouldn’t even know how to turn it on. That > probably sounds like an extreme example, but that > is the level of HUGE holes that the CFA leaves in > your knowledge base (assuming no prior > background). They leave out the most basic and > useful things in favor of the most arcane and > useless things. It’s not even about getting a > hotshot job, it’s about feeling like it was time > well spent. At least the CFA is cheap (I think the whole thing cost my company about $6000). The real rip-off is business school. Taking on loans and time off work, to sit through useless presentations to end up with meaningless grades on meaningless tests that you CAN’T fail even if you tired to (as long as you paid your tuitions off-course), now that’s a rip-off.
+1 well put mo34!
bromion Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > fxguy1234 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > I would encourage anybody interested in finance > to > > pursue the CFA purely from a point of the > pursuit > > of knowledge for knowledge’s sake rather than > the > > expected payoff of landing a hot shot PM job. > > You’ll probably be let down. > > Knowledge is great. But why focus on arcane things > that very few people actually use for anything? It > would be like reading about race cars for 18 > months without ever driving the car.You could > calculate the physics of the car under different > scenarios, talk about what kind of tires are best > for certain tracks and weather conditions, etc., > but when you actually sat down in the car, you > wouldn’t even know how to turn it on. That > probably sounds like an extreme example, but that > is the level of HUGE holes that the CFA leaves in > your knowledge base (assuming no prior > background). They leave out the most basic and > useful things in favor of the most arcane and > useless things. It’s not even about getting a > hotshot job, it’s about feeling like it was time > well spent. Name some of these HUGE holes bromion… Just from my experience - I have been out of undergrad for 2 years now (accounting major) and having almost 2 levels of the CFA allows me to talk to traders, strategists, economists, and portfolio managers that I deal with in their vernacular. I’m able to hold a conversation and understand what the hell they are talking about. Not to mention reading financial press - Reuters, WSJ, Bloomberg etc, I’m able to feel comfortable with the material and comprehend most of it. I feel like I have gotten a great “base” of knowledge from the CFA thus far. Are their holes? Im sure there are but, you cant learn everything from a book. Alot of the above probably would fly over my head (some still does) unless I’d been grinding on CFA. I’m sorry you feel that you’ve wasted your time. I couldn’t disagree more for my personal situation. I don’t know you situation but coming out of undergrad with just an accounting background and limited finance experience , I think CFA was a good move for me.
good points, fxguy1234
My main complaint about CFA is that it’s largely a short-term cramfest. You try and overload your brain with info over a short period of time, dump it all out on paper over 6 hours and sadly that’s really it for a lot of the material. Four weeks after the L1 exam I couldn’t for the life of me remember most the crap I had just been examined on. I think the material is acceptable (you will never make every happy on that one), just not convinced about the structure/methodology of the qualification.