Hi, As a Muslim I am concerned about being involved in dealing with Riba (interest) based transactions during my work as CFA… We are prohibited to conduct , write , record , facilitate , interest based lending relationships. I want to know that does the work of CFA involves dealing in such interest based transactions ? Thank you.
joke, right? muslims and finance do not get along. any which way you look at it, every transaction in finance is somehow connected to someone making interest. theres a reason why judeo-christian nations rule the world.
Yeah, stick to commodites with no margin buddy. Go read “The Ascent of Money” and you’ll realize that 99.9999% of finance is essentially buying risk through interest rates.
Let’s not go why and If judeo-Christian nations are leading the world. That would take us to different page and we certainly dont want to go there. If every transaction somehow involves someone making interest than how about an investor dealing in equities and an analyst reporting on equities rather than debt ? MattLikesAnalysis Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > joke, right? muslims and finance do not get along. > any which way you look at it, every transaction in > finance is somehow connected to someone making > interest. theres a reason why judeo-christian > nations rule the world.
MattLikesAnalysis Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > joke, right? muslims and finance do not get along. > any which way you look at it, every transaction in > finance is somehow connected to someone making > interest. theres a reason why judeo-christian > nations rule the world. Don’t be anal dude, the OP is asking a valid question.
ok, plain buy and sell equity transactions don’t directly involve interests. But equities in the CFA text are also involved in leveraged and short selling transactions, which always end up involving some interest at some point. And to value them you use some governent debt component in the discount rate. Wait, lol why am I feeding the troll, I’ll play along: My revised answer: No, the CFAI won’t deal with prohibited interest, as well as won’t involve pork of any kind.
Acid they way i see it (being a muslim myself), CFA certification is a way to gain knowledge. How you use this knowledge to ear money is a different thing. So my advice to you would be learn with a open heart and apply that knowledge selectively !
Many thanks akhan. Finally I get some sensible , impartial response. Could you also tell me what kind of work , any CFA be involved in , say , a fund manager ?
Someone holding the CFA charter can be involved in any kind of work they wish. Usually people who go after the charter are looking to break into or are in equity research or an analyst position in a fund. If you were actually a fund manager (ie. touching/moving money) I believe that would be a transaction that would conflict with your theology. However, as an analyst, simply commenting on products/transactions, you should be fine?
i’m not being rude, i’m just being honest. using his words, “We are prohibited to conduct , write , record , facilitate , interest based lending relationships.” to write or help in the writing of equity reports about a company that receives interest or pays interest of any kind would be a sin. you are encouraging the purchase of an entity that deals in interest based lending relationships. it is almost impossible to have any decent job in finance and not facilitate the purchase of a security or entity that does not partake in interest based lending relationships. an equity is just a front for your beliefs. this is why buying cigarette, liquor, and gun companies is looked down upon. you are directly supporting the marketing and profit from sinful devices. if interest is a sin, investing is a sin, period.
Acid Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Let’s not go why and If judeo-Christian nations > are leading the world. That would take us to > different page and we certainly dont want to go > there. > > If every transaction somehow involves someone > making interest than how about an investor dealing > in equities and an analyst reporting on equities > rather than debt ? the statement was judeo-christian countries rule the world, not lead it. i’ll remind you that judeo-christian countries own over 98% of the world’s atomic weapons and most of the other 2% is owned by non-religious countries/governments…
^^ Well in the 2% there must be Pakistan, which one day could very well be run by an islamic government.
Asset_management did cover your question comprehensively. Whether any finance job can be fully shariah compliant ? Simple answer NO. Why simply because every transaction has in some way an interest component (literal or implied ). So what do you do? simple answer dont enter finance profession ! However that is not a particle solution for many reasons. What i can offer you is my situation. I provide investment analysis to a "shariah compliant " real estate/infrastructure company. While i know this is not fully riba free it is better than working in structured finance or something in an IB, at the same time i am on a constant look out for a job in islamic finance (which i see as a long term goal) hope this helps
I think Islamic banking is a joke and an emotional blackmailing tool. No way can they run a banking system that doesn’t use the principles of traditional finance. Even if you’re trading Sukuk (Islamic Bonds) or Equities, you can’t value them without an interest rate. Having said that, Equities are considered Shariah Compliant but if you really want to sideline yourself from this “interest based finance” then quite frankly, this isn’t the right profession for you. The safest Riba free investments you’ll find when you invest directly in the business.
@ASSET MANAGEMENT: yes, analyzing/commenting is absolutely fine. MattLikesAnalysis Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > i’m not being rude, i’m just being honest. > > using his words, “We are prohibited to conduct , > write , record , facilitate , interest based > lending relationships.” > > to write or help in the writing of equity reports > about a company that receives interest or pays > interest of any kind would be a sin. you are > encouraging the purchase of an entity that deals > in interest based lending relationships. it is > almost impossible to have any decent job in > finance and not facilitate the purchase of a > security or entity that does not partake in > interest based lending relationships. an equity is > just a front for your beliefs. this is why buying > cigarette, liquor, and gun companies is looked > down upon. you are directly supporting the > marketing and profit from sinful devices. if > interest is a sin, investing is a sin, period. I did manage to get to the punch line and traditional theologist do suggest that we should provide ‘zero faciliation’ to companies which involves interest however I believe thats impossible in our age and hence I rule is : Do not lend on interest / Do not ask for interest Do not be an agent of interest based relationships.
Your definition of ‘ruling nations’ is unorthodox and quite funny. By your definition those nations who rule the world have atomic power. I would be surprised if there is any relationship between a stable , growing economy and possession of atomic bombs. By the way , the rest 2% of countries which possess atomic weapons consists of ‘Islamic Republic of Pakistan’’.
akhan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Asset_management did cover your question > comprehensively. Whether any finance job can be > fully shariah compliant ? Simple answer NO. Why > simply because every transaction has in some way > an interest component (literal or implied ). > > So what do you do? simple answer dont enter > finance profession ! However that is not a > particle solution for many reasons. What i can > offer you is my situation. > I provide investment analysis to a "shariah > compliant " real estate/infrastructure company. > While i know this is not fully riba free it is > better than working in structured finance or > something in an IB, at the same time i am on a > constant look out for a job in islamic finance > (which i see as a long term goal) > > > hope this helps ---------------------- Thats exactly what I am aiming for. I know we cant escape Riba but that doesnt mean that we shouldnt be involved in finance. That is not the spirit of Shariah. Can you guide me If CFA would be a good qualification If I want to pursue career in Islamic Finance ? Or would you recommend any other qualification ? At the moment I work at one of the Big 4.
Butt Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I think Islamic banking is a joke and an emotional > blackmailing tool. > > No way can they run a banking system that doesn’t > use the principles of traditional finance. Even if > you’re trading Sukuk (Islamic Bonds) or Equities, > you can’t value them without an interest rate. > > Having said that, Equities are considered Shariah > Compliant but if you really want to sideline > yourself from this “interest based finance” then > quite frankly, this isn’t the right profession for > you. > > The safest Riba free investments you’ll find when > you invest directly in the business. ----- Mr. Butt , Many people with shallow knowledge of Islamic Finance takes it to be a gimmick or emotional blackmail. Even Islamic Finance have to be valued using Interest Rates but that’s the temporary transitory solution.
What is the logic behind banning interest based transactions? Why is that a sin? I don’t see the issue with it morally if both parties enter into it of their own free will.
Carson Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > What is the logic behind banning interest based > transactions? Why is that a sin? > > I don’t see the issue with it morally if both > parties enter into it of their own free will. The reason behind prohibition is less spiritual and more logical / economical. I myself am researching this area and so will leave it to you to find how interest is bad for the economy and mankind.