I would like your thoughts on this. I’m doing CPA first, then CFA directly after it. I think the CPA/CFA combo might be more valuable than an MBA possibly, maybe not a top 10 MBA though. MBA, yeah it looks nice and its expensive but, CFA = analyst and manage investments, CPA = sign off on papers for the firm, which seems more credible. Ultimate goal is probably CPA/CFA/Wharton MBA, not easy but seems like the best scenario. Just an opinion though. I have talked to some investment firms, and each manager of the firm seems to have a different opinion on which one they prefer and it depends on what type of investment firm they run. quant vs fundamental, etc. Some managers don’t value the CFA at all and some cherish it. What I am trying to figure out is if more managers cherish it over the ones that don’t. CFA seems perfect for the buyside/sellside analyst role as well as other jobs that require valuation of securities. (all asset classes, but mostly EQ and FI)
Are you working right now? You’ve set quite an ambitious schedule ahead of yourself. Do you have the necessary state accountancy coursework to complete the CPA exams? Honestly the CPA/CFA/Wharton MBA would be overkill. If you go to Wharton forget about the CFA or CPA, that will set you up by itself. You’re on a CFA board so the answers you’ll receive might be somewhat biased. I just went through an interview process and I can’t tell you how many times I was asked about my CFA candidacy. I haven’t run into too many money managers, maybe 1 or 2, that felt the CFA wasn’t valuable. The guys that didn’t were quant propeller heads. They were right though, the CFA didn’t really provide any value to their style of management/trading.
Yeah the firms that did not like CFA were quant/tech. I am working yes. I already have the coursework, signed up for a state and taking the first part of the cpa in a couple weeks. Taking Audit first, Financial Last. CFA has a lot on the FSA section, so taking FAR of CPA last will be a good refresher. Ok, Wharton MBA I just threw out there, not really sure about going after a top MBA yet. CPA/CFA might be enough to get the job done. An MBA might be overrated and not needed.
i want to go on the buy side, stuck on the sell side right now
quant will always look down on CFA, as requires almost 0 math skills
Allegro, how quickly are you taking the exams? I would caution of leaving FAR last because it might jeopardize the 18 month window of passing all the exams. You might want to take AUD or BEC last because those are easier with less material.
If you want to work buy side asset management just get the CFA…why are you even bothering with CPA?
Is there any state where you can still get the CPA license without actually working as an auditor for a period of time? Maybe you plan to do that but seems like a big investment if you don’t plan to do that for a career. Not sure how valuable “passed CPA exams but don’t have license” is.
For CPA, to be able to use the letters without experience under a licensed CPA, you Have to find a dual-license state. Illinois just switched, so now you have to have experience, to use CPA. I believe Alabama still has it, or one of those states. The one I found requires more ACC classes than most states though. Google search dual license CPA and you’ll find the 2 or 3 left. I’m doing the same, with MBA Possibly down thee road. Have shitty job now, and might as well do it while I have time and am Looking for greener pastures.
JDCFA Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Is there any state where you can still get the CPA > license without actually working as an auditor for > a period of time? Maybe you plan to do that but > seems like a big investment if you don’t plan to > do that for a career. Not sure how valuable > “passed CPA exams but don’t have license” is. Colorado?
I have 3.5 years worth of CFA qualified experience. In .5 years I should hopefully have CPA passed. AUD- may 20th BEC- July 1st REG - aug 30th FAR - October 2010 I want to either switch to an audit job for a few years or get into big 4 business valuation. I have learned with my current job all of the different opportunities you can have it you have both CPA audit/valuation experience as well as the CFA. Not saying I will for sure be able to pass everything, but hope to go all out with this goal at 100% effort and commitment. You can have a versatile career and great opportunities from what I have seen up from hedge funds, private equity, venture capital, stock valuation, etc, etc. Yes it does not at all qualify for quant stuff. I am lookin for the standard bottom up/top down fundamental analysis type of firm. I also got a standard finance and accounting degree, not the MIT type which is the quant that you guys are talking about. I have seen big 4 auditors who specialize in say “healthcare or Pharma”, get the CPA+CFA and get pharma style venture cap jobs or become buy side pharma stock analyst. Which is a deep industry knowledge that you can’t pick p anywhere. I have also seen a lot of biology/physics or science majors work at scientific research firms, then pass CFA and switch to a buyside industry focused job. It’s that specific knowledge the firms want. Not all state like NY or NJ require direct audit work either, some states have more general experience requirements which if a cpa signs off on, then you are good.
Top 10 MBA > CFA by far in terms of career opportunity. You might get recuiting into PIMCO out of wharton. A cfa from a small to mid asset management will probably be turned down unless she/he is a star manager. Plus w/ top mba u get opportunity to go to sellside/consulting which you can’t with a cfa. If you do want to work in asset management a CFA is pretty much required but its sort of like just a ticket to play.
Thank you for the info, it is obvious now that if I do not have the top10 MBA I am never going to get anywhere. CFA can only get us so far.
I have both. In general top10 mba is more respected and has way better exit (job) opps. But I actually think they are quite complementary, as a CFA gives you the education and an MBA gives you the network and job opps. The biggest downside to the mba is cost…my savings covered a good chunk and yet the pretax bill on my loans still comes to $7k a year for 10 years. ouch
naturallight Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I have both. In general top10 mba is more > respected and has way better exit (job) opps. But > I actually think they are quite complementary, as > a CFA gives you the education and an MBA gives you > the network and job opps. > > The biggest downside to the mba is cost…my > savings covered a good chunk and yet the pretax > bill on my loans still comes to $7k a year for 10 > years. ouch Just out of curiosity, how much were you able to save? I’m currently saving roughly $12k a year for b-school, which I’m hoping will cover living expenses, books, etc.
If you’re aiming for business valuation the order is: CFA > MBA > CPA In fact, CPA will help very little, if at all. Yes, it’ll give you credibility, but the quickest path would be CFA / MBA. Top MBA helps for networking opportunities, but aside from that, I know many top IB firms that look down on it and treasure the CFA - this depends on the firm. It’s relative too, because if you don’t make it into the top 10 MBA, the costs involved and the benefits derived is very questionable. I heard of top 20 MBA students still being unemployed - and keep in mind, there are many non-MBAs that have pretty good jobs. MBA means nothing in the accounting field, means something in the finance field (if top 10), but overall, a vanity piece. Professional designations get you further with jobs than MBA. In California, you don’t need audit experience for a CPA. I agree with you that if you do get a CPA license and work for the big 4, you can transition yourself to the business valuation side more easily. CPAs are now trying to get into the business valuation business (warfare between CPA vs. CFA on this). It never hurts to get as much as possible. I don’t think it’s overkill - but then again, I always believe you should be able to master at least 2 different fields. Good luck on getting into the top 10 though because it’s very hard. Have you looked at the resumes? Most of the people made it to top positions in IB and/or are entrepreneurs… and under 30. I also want to mention - things like business valuation are very niche fields, and a close-knit club. If you have connections, there is no need for an MBA. MBA gets your foot in the door, designations are proof that you are competent, but connections are key. You would be surprised that everyone knows EVERYONE in a particular area.
Oh yeah, I would also like to add that after you get the job, no one cares where you graduated from. It’s pure talent/skill and/or ability to curry favor with management that matters in the end. I can not tell you how many times I have seen non-MBAs pass up MBAs in positions, because your performance trumps all. I have come across many incompetent MBAs from top schools, and also can say that there are a lot of management that don’t have MBAs (they usually have professional designations, and/or other degrees, like a JD, Ph.D., etc.). I have also come across brilliant people that don’t have the “personality” factor. Look good on paper, but when it came down to interviews, they weren’t “personable” and didn’t “fit in with the company’s corporate culture.” Real life is not that cut and dry.
Ocean Mist Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > If you’re aiming for business valuation the order > is: > CFA > MBA > CPA > > In fact, CPA will help very little, if at all. > Yes, it’ll give you credibility, but the quickest > path would be CFA / MBA. Top MBA helps for > networking opportunities, but aside from that, I > know many top IB firms that look down on it and > treasure the CFA - this depends on the firm. > > It’s relative too, because if you don’t make it > into the top 10 MBA, the costs involved and the > benefits derived is very questionable. I heard of > top 20 MBA students still being unemployed - and > keep in mind, there are many non-MBAs that have > pretty good jobs. MBA means nothing in the > accounting field, means something in the finance > field (if top 10), but overall, a vanity piece. > Professional designations get you further with > jobs than MBA. > > In California, you don’t need audit experience for > a CPA. I agree with you that if you do get a CPA > license and work for the big 4, you can transition > yourself to the business valuation side more > easily. CPAs are now trying to get into the > business valuation business (warfare between CPA > vs. CFA on this). > > It never hurts to get as much as possible. I don’t > think it’s overkill - but then again, I always > believe you should be able to master at least 2 > different fields. > > Good luck on getting into the top 10 though > because it’s very hard. Have you looked at the > resumes? Most of the people made it to top > positions in IB and/or are entrepreneurs… and > under 30. > > I also want to mention - things like business > valuation are very niche fields, and a close-knit > club. If you have connections, there is no need > for an MBA. MBA gets your foot in the door, > designations are proof that you are competent, but > connections are key. You would be surprised that > everyone knows EVERYONE in a particular area. Thanks, interesting to see the CFA>MBA that you mentioned for business valuation. So really, networking+CFA might be the way to go vs top MBA if its not achievable. Maybe because CFA is directly related to business valuation? and those skills can really bring a lot to the table. Hearing that the CFA is better gives me more motivation. It cost a lot less for one, the CFA is more interesting for two, and 3 its directly related to the job function along with respect and a network of others that have taken it. The CFA institute seems to have its own network like an MBA program does.
Ocean Mist Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Oh yeah, I would also like to add that after you > get the job, no one cares where you graduated > from. It’s pure talent/skill and/or ability to > curry favor with management that matters in the > end. I can not tell you how many times I have seen > non-MBAs pass up MBAs in positions, because your > performance trumps all. I have come across many > incompetent MBAs from top schools, and also can > say that there are a lot of management that don’t > have MBAs (they usually have professional > designations, and/or other degrees, like a JD, > Ph.D., etc.). I have also come across brilliant > people that don’t have the “personality” factor. > Look good on paper, but when it came down to > interviews, they weren’t “personable” and didn’t > “fit in with the company’s corporate culture.” > > Real life is not that cut and dry. I have also seen this Ocean Mist in the work force, the non-MBA passing the MBA because of raw talent of the profession. Occasionally the top MBA feels as though they are already accomplished and have more of a sense of arrogance that someone owes them something, vs the CFA who gets straight to the point and knows his stuff. If that makes any sense. Sounds as to the point of me starting this thread I have deemed the CFA>MBA!! To be honest with you, I know MBA is important but it just will seem really really boring, I have a feeling its all presentations and working in groups. Yeah its good for you, but kind of boring vs CFA terms. Im hoping that a strong accounting/finance/econ background, supplemented by CPA passed and the CFA and networks, can outweigh MBA. Still need to take GMAT though and see how that goes.
https://www.cfainstitute.org/cipm/courseofstudy/curriculum/Pages/index.aspx CIPM, does anyone think this is worth getting or going for? to supplement CFA study? Study CIPM May - Dec, CFA study Jan - June