Does anyone here know if minorities ( hispanics, african americans) get held to lower standards when applying to B schools? Ive heard from some of my friends that their chances of being accepted are much higher than those of whites and asians. Would anyone have any first hand knowledge of this?
Yes, except at some universities, like the UCs where it is illegal. As a side note, it seems like every Affirmative Action topic that gets posted anywhere tends to escalate into a huge flame war. I’ll try not to say too much…
Top business schools have predefined proportions for International students, and applicants compete with people from the same region for those spots, thus lowering standars for say Latin American students. However I don’t know for sure if the same rules apply to U.S. citizens from different ethnicities, but apparently that’s the case too.
I doubt you will get any statistical breakdown, but I think it is 100% true. There are only so many Whites and Asians with GMATs over 700 you can take without hurting the appeal of the school to those seeking diversity. To potential students and employeers alike.
i am hisp and got a ton of feedback on b schools… while my stats are the same as whites i bring something different to the table. I am from the USA so I am not a work visa issue. Tons of good kids from out of the nation but they have the visa issue so schools will bend over backwards for blacks, hisps that are from the USA. with the same stats I think I will get more funding simply because i am a minoritity. losts of blacks/hisp dont go to b school… its not higher number are admits but much less apply…
Ive been looking for stats but I cant seem to find any. I know that average gmat scores are low for hispanics and even lower for african americans but no info on schools acceptance rates.
i dont remember what school but they have stats for minorities from the USA
THACHARTER Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Ive been looking for stats but I cant seem to find > any. I know that average gmat scores are low for > hispanics and even lower for african americans but > no info on schools acceptance rates. Stanford Asian students: 25% UC Berkeley Asian students: 45% I think this says a lot.
Not sure the data is externally available.
goldenboy09 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > i am hisp and got a ton of feedback on b schools… > while my stats are the same as whites i bring > something different to the table. I am from the > USA so I am not a work visa issue. Tons of good > kids from out of the nation but they have the visa > issue so schools will bend over backwards for > blacks, hisps that are from the USA. > > with the same stats I think I will get more > funding simply because i am a minoritity. losts of > blacks/hisp dont go to b school… > > its not higher number are admits but much less > apply… About this, the visa is not an issue at all. Once a foreign student has a confirmed admission, the student visa process is very straightforward if you’re not coming from f*cking Somalia. In addition, I doubt U.S. Hispanics are considered in the exact same pool as foreign nationals from Latin America because of the different educational background.
I think its less of an issue for top MBA’s than good undergraduate programs as: - international students are more common (they still get to add to their diversity if you are a noble Spaniard vs a Mexican American Immigrant who worked his way up) - pool of available slots is smaller and applicants are of higher caliber to begin with ( eg to get 20% latino you’re looking at only 200 vs 2000- so its still the cream of the crop. I agree its still gonna be a factor- but I think less so than in large undergrad programs that allow affirmative action. I would also think women are at an even better advantage as they are less interested while the programs are still looking for a balance.
US Hispanics are not grouped with international applicants.
Here’s some data. It’s a bit outdated, but it’s probably still realistic today. http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1993/5/7/report-discloses-sats-admit-rate-pa/
Part-time Crook Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > goldenboy09 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > i am hisp and got a ton of feedback on b > schools… > > while my stats are the same as whites i bring > > something different to the table. I am from the > > USA so I am not a work visa issue. Tons of good > > kids from out of the nation but they have the > visa > > issue so schools will bend over backwards for > > blacks, hisps that are from the USA. > > > > with the same stats I think I will get more > > funding simply because i am a minoritity. losts > of > > blacks/hisp dont go to b school… > > > > its not higher number are admits but much less > > apply… > > About this, the visa is not an issue at all. Once > a foreign student has a confirmed admission, the > student visa process is very straightforward if > you’re not coming from f*cking Somalia. In > addition, I doubt U.S. Hispanics are considered in > the exact same pool as foreign nationals from > Latin America because of the different educational > background. i was talking about firms hiring people not to attend school
Hello Mister Walrus Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > US Hispanics are not grouped with international > applicants. thank god
goldenboy09 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > i was talking about firms hiring people not to > attend school International students who want to work in the U.S. after graduation apply for an OPT working permit about six months before finishing graduate school. Employers don’t have to file a request for this, and if the guy went to a top program the working permit is always granted.
This is a touchy issue. I am a minority (think black/hispanic)… …mid 20s, CFA charterholder, and MBA aspirant. I have a mid-700s GMAT, top liberal arts undergrad, and work in a front office role at a well known wall st firm (over 100,000 employees globally), and I have worked on 3 continents…this is just to give you some background. I agree that on average, minorities have lower average test scores. However, that does not take into account family backgrounds and lack of preparation materials, as well as quality of schools. This being an analytical forum, people are well aware that inputs determine outputs. I was fortunate enough to have access to the same study materials that whites/asians use (a.k.a I was not disadvantaged in terms of resources), and you can see that I got the same scores that they got. I know that if I’m able to get into a top school like HBS or Stanford this year, my achievement will forever be “tainted” by people who think that I had an easier time getting in…they will quickly forget the >1,000 hrs I put in to get my charter, my mid 700s GMAT, GPA, work experience etc…and FOCUS JUST ON MY SKIN COLOR to conclude that I was advantaged. In any case, if I was advantaged, that is beyond my control, and I hope people respect my hustle. Truth is, I would probably get in even if I was white, given my background. In life, you just have to work hard and reach your maximum potential. I don’t let these stereotypes deter me from venturing into the ivy-lined hallways, because I have been toughened by years of reaching into unchartered territory. I hope to set an example for young people of ALL RACES, regarding the value of hard work and respect for others’ achievements in a color-blind way. OK…I know AnalystForum can be abrasive sometimes, but that’s why we love it…reactions!
Part-time Crook Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > goldenboy09 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > > > i was talking about firms hiring people not to > > attend school > > International students who want to work in the > U.S. after graduation apply for an OPT working > permit about six months before finishing graduate > school. Employers don’t have to file a request for > this, and if the guy went to a top program the > working permit is always granted. cool
O.G. Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I know that if I’m able to get into a top school > like HBS or Stanford this year, my achievement > will forever be “tainted” by people who think that > I had an easier time getting in…they will > quickly forget the >1,000 hrs I put in to get my > charter, my mid 700s GMAT, GPA, work experience > etc…and FOCUS JUST ON MY SKIN COLOR to conclude > that I was advantaged. > I disagree. If you are an intelligent person people will notice it during the first week working with you. Yes you will probably have a break if you get in but as you mentioned that’s beyond your control. That happened to me although I was an international student. I’m from Argentina and got a GMAT well over 700, and 99th percentile in the quantitative section. A couple of years of nice experience before business school made the trick to a top three program. For people from Latin American countries, that’s like a sure ticket as opposed to people from other countries. During my time in business school a Korean friend told me that for them anything below a 99th percentile in the quant section and you could kiss good-bye your admission process to any decent school, even maybe top 20. You are a U.S. citizen but such special considerations still apply for you. Use them.
I think if you went strictly by gmat and gpa, the top schools would be comprised almost entirely of male indian IT software engineers. I think mba school is a little unique in that you learn so much from your classmates. It’s not like undergrad where you sit back and listen to the prof and take notes. Inside the classroom, you’re expected to be actively engaged and contributing to the discussion. Outside of the classroom, everything is a group project. This is why the schools look at their classes holistically. They’re trying to create a class with as many different backgrounds, work experiences, and future career goals as possible. I learned way more from the guy in my class who was previously in the army and the guy who lived in africa than from any of the other finance guys. So I don’t think it’s about lower standards. I think it’s about creating a class that’s going to have the maximum benefit to each of the students in that class.