Looking for a little insight into salary negotiations for a new hire position. When making a counteroffer after you’ve requested a 24 hour period to review the initial offer, is it more appropriate to e-mail your increased request or should this only be done by telephone? Many thanks for your replies.
I’m not trying to scare you, but I have seen situations where offers were pulled during negotiations. If the offer is in the ball park of what you are looking for, then its probably fine to do it via email, but if you sense that they will be shocked when they read your email, call them. By calling, you can get a sense of whether you are rocking the boat with your counter offer.
I’d encourage you to do it by phone. It’s much easier for someone to misinterpret the tone of an email message, and if you have an actual conversation you’ll get instant feedback (from the tone of their response even if they don’t give you a response on the spot). I think people often make the mistake of putting difficult or sensitive requests in email simply because it’s easier to do than make a tough phone call. But it’s also much easier to blow off an email request. So I’d say take a few minutes to organize your thoughts and then pick up the phone.
+1 for the phone I wish salary would come up a lot earlier in the process like it did in my last few job inquiries. There is nothing like going through several hours/rounds of interviews only to realize it was a colossal waste of everyone’s time because they aren’t even close on the money.
True, it’s not a great time in our business so this isn’t really the time/place to start asking for $20/$30K more than your offer. A lot of people are being laid off so it’s probably wise to just be thankful that you have a gig. Willy
Are people even bothering to negotiate comp right now? I’m not saying people should low ball themselves, but if the comp is in the range, I wouldn’t risk losing a good offer in a bad market. Get some experience and you will be able to add a sizeable amount to your comp when the market recovers and firms start hiring in earnest.
Do you know what the median salary for the position is? Have some evidence before you start.
Great feedback. The position is in Portfolio Management and the company contacted me. First interview turned out to be a panel where (first time this has ever happened to me) I was offered the position at the end of the interview. Base was quoted around 80k with bonus being 40%. I’m in a good growth position now however I like the opportunity this presents. Current base is higher so I figured asking for 95 and getting 90 might be possible.
I think you should definitely call. Be sure to first explain “i’m very excited about this position for reasons x, y, and z.” and then “however, i’m currently making $xx and was hoping to at least trade flat in to this position…” i think they should sympathize with your situation. do you have any cost of living points to also make if you’re going to a new city?
They offered you a base lower than what you currently make?
See, I’m so under market right now that any fair offer is going to be a nice jump for me. I gave the HR person a range in the phone interview when she asked. She said we were on the same page, so we moved forward. The low number of my range was +20% from where I am now.
Do you get a bonus at the moment??? If they offer 40% bonus can that improve the following year to say 60% or more. Be flexible it is a difficult market, see if you can get your additional compensation in another way than just base. Find out what your chances are of getting your bonus. How is it worked out, are there KPI’s? Or Is it purely discretionary. I’d always use the phone, you’re not demanding a ransom, it’s a negotiation where both parties need to feel loved!!
Thanks very much for the feedback all. Great help.
always gotta negotiate if you feel like you should. make sure you are gracious and pleasant, but remember that you’ll never get something if you don’t ask for it. hiring is an expensive process and i would argue that if you are in the ballpark, then you SHOULD ask for more (if you believe you deserve it) since the company would rather give you that little bit extra than to lose you to their second choice candidate. and even if there’s a second-choice candidate who’s nearly as impressive as you, employers tend to make a mental commitment to the person they’re hiring, maybe more than they should if it were based purely on merits. an example of a discussion i had during a negotiation (broadly simplified): *numi*: hi! just wanted to thank you again for the offer and i really am excited about the opportunity to work with your firm *hiring manager*: that’s awesome! *numi*: you know, i had a chance to think about the offer and i had some questions for you *hiring manager*: go for it buddy *numi*: well, i was wondering if you could walk me through how you determined my salary and projected bonus. i’ve thought about the numbers you’re offering me, and, well…it would just be helpful for me to understand how you came up with it. *hiring manager*: (blah blah blah insert random reasons blah blah) *numi*: i see…well, as a matter of perspective, i made $XX last year and am expecting to make $YY this year, and my understanding of the job market combined with another job offer i’ve received suggests that a range of $ZZ would be more in-line with what i was looking for. i’d really like this to work out for everyone and would definitely like to join your firm, but i’m just trying to make sense of the offer as it stands right now. *hiring manager*: well, we’ll see what we can do. we think our offer is fair and it is a great opportunity here at our firm. what would you say would be a more reasonable offer? *numi (with number already in mind)*: i think $WW would be more in-line with what i was expecting. i know that you and your team would like to get this wrapped up as soon as possible and i would too. i’ve thought a lot about this but if we can come to an agreement on this, i would be confident to sign off on this right away and make these negotiations a thing of the past. *hiring manager*: all right, you win. *numi*: cool, dude. anyway, the actual conversation was a bit more formal in certain respects and took place over a couple days, but that’s the gist of what happened. after some negotiations, i found myself with an offer that was a fair bit more than what i was originally approached with. my “friendly” negotiation tactic may or may not work for you – different people have different approaches, but i like to keep things pleasant and rather than telling someone what *i’m* looking for, i like to ask the other person how *they* came up with what they’re willing to offer me. that way, even though it’s obvious that the ball is in your court (since you wouldn’t be asking them if you were happy with your offer anyway), they feel a sense of control that you’re asking them for their opinion…and believe it or not, they’re much more likely to oblige this way! good luck to you and let me know how things go
Thanks Numi, great post and a good tactic for friendly negotiation. I don’t weant to beat them over the head with this as I’ll be working with these people after the dust settles.
Asking the employer how they determined the offer…very interesting. I have never thought of this approach before. Numi, thanks for sharing your thoughts.
no problem guys. glad this helped. i have to give credit to one of my friends from GS banking on this one. if you can say things with grace and with a smile, you’re so much more likely to get what you want. i know there are different methods of negotiation, but i myself have found if you keep up a pleasant and polished demeanor, you can often get what you want without making anyone else feel uncomfortable. and that’s something everyone can benefit from, right?
also helps a great deal if you are employed with a job you like. The employer knows this and recognizes that they have to step up or the risk of losing you is very real. If you are negotiating from a position of unemployment, you lose a fair amount of credibility being a tough negotiator.
numi Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > always gotta negotiate if you feel like you > should. make sure you are gracious and pleasant, > but remember that you’ll never get something if > you don’t ask for it. hiring is an expensive > process and i would argue that if you are in the > ballpark, then you SHOULD ask for more (if you > believe you deserve it) since the company would > rather give you that little bit extra than to lose > you to their second choice candidate. and even if > there’s a second-choice candidate who’s nearly as > impressive as you, employers tend to make a mental > commitment to the person they’re hiring, maybe > more than they should if it were based purely on > merits. > > an example of a discussion i had during a > negotiation (broadly simplified): > > *numi*: hi! just wanted to thank you again for the > offer and i really am excited about the > opportunity to work with your firm > *hiring manager*: that’s awesome! > *numi*: you know, i had a chance to think about > the offer and i had some questions for you > *hiring manager*: go for it buddy > *numi*: well, i was wondering if you could walk me > through how you determined my salary and projected > bonus. i’ve thought about the numbers you’re > offering me, and, well…it would just be helpful > for me to understand how you came up with it. > *hiring manager*: (blah blah blah insert random > reasons blah blah) > *numi*: i see…well, as a matter of perspective, > i made $XX last year and am expecting to make $YY > this year, and my understanding of the job market > combined with another job offer i’ve received > suggests that a range of $ZZ would be more in-line > with what i was looking for. i’d really like this > to work out for everyone and would definitely like > to join your firm, but i’m just trying to make > sense of the offer as it stands right now. > *hiring manager*: well, we’ll see what we can do. > we think our offer is fair and it is a great > opportunity here at our firm. what would you say > would be a more reasonable offer? > *numi (with number already in mind)*: i think $WW > would be more in-line with what i was expecting. i > know that you and your team would like to get this > wrapped up as soon as possible and i would too. > i’ve thought a lot about this but if we can come > to an agreement on this, i would be confident to > sign off on this right away and make these > negotiations a thing of the past. > *hiring manager*: all right, you win. > *numi*: cool, dude. > > anyway, the actual conversation was a bit more > formal in certain respects and took place over a > couple days, but that’s the gist of what happened. > after some negotiations, i found myself with an > offer that was a fair bit more than what i was > originally approached with. > > my “friendly” negotiation tactic may or may not > work for you – different people have different > approaches, but i like to keep things pleasant and > rather than telling someone what *i’m* looking > for, i like to ask the other person how *they* > came up with what they’re willing to offer me. > that way, even though it’s obvious that the ball > is in your court (since you wouldn’t be asking > them if you were happy with your offer anyway), > they feel a sense of control that you’re asking > them for their opinion…and believe it or not, > they’re much more likely to oblige this way! > > good luck to you and let me know how things go great post. But, what happens if the employer says he came up with his figure based on what others made in a similar position at the firm, and that the firm has a salary scale.
Hey numi, Great post, but I was wondering what are the approximate values for $XX, $YY, $ZZ, and $WW? Is there a strategy with how you present the numbers? For example, if $XX is 100k, how do you target the other numbers for the greatest chance of success and pay bump?