Will the SEC renew this ban? It didn’t help WaMu or Wachovia at all, not that it should have. The market experienced one of its worst days in history without added short sellers. Anybody else feel like there is a giant mass of investors/institutions waiting for the gate to drop?
I hope the hell not. Maybe other markets will return to normal once this ban is removed. The convertible bond market has seized up because buyers can’t hedge themsleves by shorting.
Whoa - the senate decides on that rejected bill tonight, as well as the proposed $250K FDIC increase . . . when does it expire tomorrow? When trading opens - or after hours?
“Given the importance of confidence in financial markets, the SEC’s action halts short selling in 799 financial institutions. The SEC’s emergency order, pursuant to its authority in Section 12(k)(2) of the Securities Exchange Act of 1934, will be immediately effective and will terminate at 11:59 p.m. ET on Oct. 2, 2008. The Commission may extend the order beyond 10 business days if it deems an extension necessary in the public interest and for the protection of investors, but will not extend the order for more than 30 calendar days in total duration.” terminate at 11:59 p.m. ET on Oct. 2, 2008
dude–that thing is getting extended until November 4th…
i had heard yest extension til oct 17th likely. i’d put good $$ on them extending it for at least a few more weeks.
BTW you cant short F or GM but short the hell out of TM and HMC. Hi Mr Honda, welcome to America
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=akxf2ZPBSrjA “U.S. regulators are likely to extend a ban on short-sales of financial stocks and is considering new protections for all publicly traded companies, NYSE Euronext Chief Executive Officer Duncan Niederauer said. Under U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission rules, the ban can be extended through Oct. 19. Investors are barred from betting on price declines for almost 980 stocks ranging from Citigroup Inc. to companies that generate only fraction of their revenue from financial activities such as AutoNation Inc.” Looks like it could go to the 19th, if not longer…
I think a compelling argument is that this ban is unconstitutional. How? Freedom of Speech and the First Amendment. Why? You are taking a negative view on a company by shorting them, and by not being able to take that view, your freedom of speech is being restricted. But can this be? No. The Supreme Court would never take this up and would defer to the SEC on this. The SEC would pull a lame excuse like “there is a severe risk by allowing short sales, yada yada yada.” I just wish the markets can be allowed to clear this mess up on its own. It’s not like the “bear raids” are going after Walmart, Johnson & Johnson, etc. If they did, they would get spanked. These financials are in horrible condition, and it’s not the short - sellers fault! Argh!
extended until Oct 17! wow
BosyBillups Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I think a compelling argument is that this ban is > unconstitutional. > > How? Freedom of Speech and the First Amendment. > Nah. > > Why? You are taking a negative view on a company > by shorting them, and by not being able to take > that view, your freedom of speech is being > restricted. > Nope. You are being stopped from doing something in a regulated market. You are free to say (or publish) whatever you want about any stock. > > But can this be? No. The Supreme Court would > never take this up and would defer to the SEC on > this. The SEC would pull a lame excuse like > “there is a severe risk by allowing short sales, > yada yada yada.” > I think the Supreme Court might take it up but it’s under “Liberty of Contract” which is a right established (sort-of) in the Constitution post BOR (too lazy to look where). The problem is that I don’t think the Supreme Court has heard a Liberty of Contract case since the 20’s or 30’s. This strikes me as one where a fundamental liberty I ought to have is the ability to lend you anything I legally own. > I just wish the markets can be allowed to clear > this mess up on its own. It’s not like the “bear > raids” are going after Walmart, Johnson & Johnson, > etc. If they did, they would get spanked. These > financials are in horrible condition, and it’s not > the short - sellers fault! Argh! Agree with all of that… Edit: “I ought to have is the ability to lend you anything I legally own.” … as long as you can legally own it too.
Seriously, I hope every financial stock that trades goes to zero.
Ridiculous. I’m starting to see that short selling has less of an effect than I once thought. If investors feel a stock should be worth zero it isn’t going to take a bunch of short sellers to get it there. WaMu and Wachovia wouldn’t have fallen much faster with additional shorts in the marketplace.
Just extended
Chuckrox8 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Ridiculous. I’m starting to see that short > selling has less of an effect than I once thought. > If investors feel a stock should be worth zero it > isn’t going to take a bunch of short sellers to > get it there. WaMu and Wachovia wouldn’t have > fallen much faster with additional shorts in the > marketplace. Amen. We need some other people to have that same kind of realization.
Chuckrox8 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Ridiculous. I’m starting to see that short > selling has less of an effect than I once thought. > If investors feel a stock should be worth zero it > isn’t going to take a bunch of short sellers to > get it there. WaMu and Wachovia wouldn’t have > fallen much faster with additional shorts in the > marketplace. The ban is a political trick that forced people to buy stock so that people in Kansas would think the market likes Bush’s bailout plan. Market will tank when the ban get lifted. My guess, they do it after an Obama win so it looks like the market doesn’t like the Democrats… Wow–look how cynical I’ve become…
ahahah Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Chuckrox8 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Ridiculous. I’m starting to see that short > > selling has less of an effect than I once > thought. > > If investors feel a stock should be worth zero > it > > isn’t going to take a bunch of short sellers to > > get it there. WaMu and Wachovia wouldn’t have > > fallen much faster with additional shorts in > the > > marketplace. > > > The ban is a political trick that forced people to > buy stock so that people in Kansas would think the > market likes Bush’s bailout plan. Market will > tank when the ban get lifted. My guess, they do > it after an Obama win so it looks like the market > doesn’t like the Democrats… Wow–look how > cynical I’ve become… Geeez, I never thought of that (lift just after an Obama win). It’s cynical, but I can see them doing that. I guess I’ve become cynical too. By the way, Intrade has Obama contracts at 65.1 this morning; McCain at 34.7.
I mean, when you think about it, Chris Cox is as political as they come…
bchadwick Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > ahahah Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Chuckrox8 Wrote: > > > -------------------------------------------------- > > > ----- > > > Ridiculous. I’m starting to see that short > > > selling has less of an effect than I once > > thought. > > > If investors feel a stock should be worth > zero > > it > > > isn’t going to take a bunch of short sellers > to > > > get it there. WaMu and Wachovia wouldn’t > have > > > fallen much faster with additional shorts in > > the > > > marketplace. > > > > > > The ban is a political trick that forced people > to > > buy stock so that people in Kansas would think > the > > market likes Bush’s bailout plan. Market will > > tank when the ban get lifted. My guess, they > do > > it after an Obama win so it looks like the > market > > doesn’t like the Democrats… Wow–look how > > cynical I’ve become… > > Geeez, I never thought of that (lift just after an > Obama win). It’s cynical, but I can see them > doing that. I guess I’ve become cynical too. > > By the way, Intrade has Obama contracts at 65.1 > this morning; McCain at 34.7. So since I’ve never been on Intrade and it’s probably not good for me does this mean that the market thinks Obama has a 65% chance of winning?