Some thoughts on AF stuff

I was writing this for the Board member thread, but it was sufficiently off topic that I decided to separate it and put it here.

Some thoughts on “decline of quality” in AF posts.

First, let me say that some of this may just be percieved on my part, but I suspect that there is a genuine decline in the number and frequency of posts that make us better or more thoughtful financial professionals (aspects insights into companies, strategies, sources of risk, ways of managing entrys/exits, aspects of quantitative approaches, etc.).

It’s also true that as I’ve gotten more experienced, the bar for what counts as a “quality post” has likely gone up, so that may also be happening here.

The fact that the industry (and economy as a whole) is going through a tough time, is probably making both new and old posters more bitter about life, and so navigating through the bitterness as an AF moderator can be a PITA. And it’s true that financial people are not known for being particularly cuddly and empathetic to others, so when they are in a bad mood, they’re perfectly happy to let the crap fly and land where it may.

It’s also true that some of our better posters from the past have just moved on to bigger and better things, so don’t come by much anymore (SuperSadFace, and MattLikesAnalysis come to mind) or been squeezed out of the industry entirely and don’t come for that reason.

There are more and more people just out of college taking these exams, so the average age of posters is probably dropping, and the experience/maturity level along with it. No real problems with that - people are allowed to be inexperienced and perhaps a bit immature- particularly when one actually *is* young, but it does mean that our financial conversations don’t seem as good as they were a few years back. I suspect that the call for a place for crude conversation is mostly from young posters who figure that the real professional world should be more or less like their dorm-room conversations, and that any suggestion that others don’t want that sounds to them like socialism, or nazisim, or some other thing they don’t actually know much about.

On the other hand, there is a silver lining here, some of our long-timers have gotten a fair amount of experience and now have good things to add, at least when when they care to. I read some stuff that some of our long-timers write and I think “wow, that’s really good analysis from so-and-so.” And then I realize “well, we’ve been at it for 4-6 years now: naturally this guy says way more thoughtful and informed stuff than when we first met.” However, a lot of us old-timers know more-or-less where each other stands and don’t necessarily feel like rehashing old arguments, so we are a little quieter.

We also don’t like giving away too much of our hard-earned knowledge for free - although, quite honestly, most people either already know things that we’ve figured out, or they don’t know enough to grasp it, so it’s not quite as bad as we tend to fear.

I know I had some part in the creation of this post. The reason behind my request is a place to escape the world i live in and speak to live minded individuals about issues and topics that are never spoken about in the office. Perhaps my usage of “crude” was incorrect but I dont alway associate crude with the negative connotation of filth or cursing but rather the most basic variables that drives human instinct; vanity and sex.

Now, I do understand the direction you are trying to move this forum but at the same time i consider my suggestion valid. You see, you have spots alloted where people can discuss the exams and investments ( which is great) and you have this section to which it is devoted for off-subject topics. There has been numerous posts about the quality, and topics, in recent posts in this section and I think a forum devoted strictly for said topics would alleviate this complaining. If you wish to turn this section into something more related to investments I’m afraid to say you will lose a lot of visotors for there are many other blogs / publications that provide this with a far more indebth analysis that most of us probably already visit. I write this with all good intentions for I actually like this section and the people who posts.

Actually, I wrote this before you asked for a “let it all hang out” section. I just didn’t post it until later.

Being banned as Semper Augustus in 2009 was a traumatising experience for me. Never got over that.

Banning people wasn’t particularly effective. That was part of the problem.

IMO knowledge is counterfiet if it isn’t shared.

All my knowledge is purely theoretical, unless ofcourse it has to do with my trade, which no one asks about anyway :slight_smile:

The trading algorithm an HFT people clearly don’t think so. And if their knowledge is counterfeit, then why are they so rich.

Even to the extent that what you say is true, that doesn’t mean knowledge has to be shared with everyone. My concern is less with sharing knowledge than with sharing something that took effort and insight to learn with those who wouldn’t reciprocate if the situation were reversed.

Trading algorithms and wisdom on AF aren’t nearly the same thing, although they could touch in certain situations. Why must it be reciprocated? I’ve found that everyone I work with has your outlook – which I find strange you have since you are clearly a helpful poster who goes into depth. I’ve found those coworkers don’t end up with the social networks and other benefits that comes from sharing that I enjoy much (and I’m much earlier in my career). Sometimes you just have to go first. If you want to get technical and self-interested, reciprocity norms can be exploited by calculated sharing of knowledge. But that is a seperate conversation. I don’t know – maybe it’s because there is a sampling bias in the area of finance you work in. I imagine that is true in some areas.

Iron sharpens iron. Only when you are willing to educate somebody to your level on a subject can they help you to grow.

The problem with making this place more finance oriented, is that we’re already doing that 40+ hours a week and we come here to escape with our peers- annonomysly. We also have much better resources at work (a meeting w/ a guy that manages $25B of EM debt at work is much more valueable than a lvl 1 candiate in India telling me he’s long AAPL). IMHO, if the board was going to be high lvl finance, it would’ve happened organically and you wont be able to try to elevate the quality of the board unless you turnover its base- and still, you’re left with problem #1 again.

This place was a great resource while I was taking my exams, it made passing and studying a lot easier… but you kinda graduate the level 1-3 boards and come to the WC to kick it after you’re done. I probably dont even go into the other sections more than once every 6 months now.

I have to agree. for the work experienced, AF is really for the exam boards. Level 3 in particular, when you are doing the old AM exams, and there’s an answer you just can’t figure out why the answer is what it is… do a search, and bingo someone has bound to have the same problem and you get your answer in the discussion.

Maybe for inexperienced folks, the investing boards may be a nice place to share investment ideas. But it doesn’t appeal to me to have to spend even more time explaining why / why not the ideas are good or not, when I got to do that all day long, and get paid for it

finally. End of discussion.

now let me tell you about this deuce I dropped today. Felt like a Mack truck coming out the tunnel. When I go to flush, it’s nowhere to be seen!?!?! Wtf??? I believe this particular category of turd is called “The Houdini”. If anyone knows the physics of The Houdini, please enlighten me.

I think bchad is right that we can elevate the level in the investment section. We’ve had some good threads lately that probably benefited a number of people. Hopefully we can have some more threads like that.

I also agree with Systematic that the quality of posts here is never going to be as good as some of us might hope. SumZero, in theory, is a great outlet for high level finance discussions. But most of the ideas on SumZero are actually pretty low quality. VIC also has some highly questionable write ups. So if the blue chip sites in the industry can’t get it right, I don’t think AF will.

what is WSO(wall street oasis) good for…i never heard anything good about them?

I’ve only ever visited the site a few times but it seemed to mostly be entry level ib analysts engaging in pissing contests about bonuses, how many hours they worked in a week, how many slides of a pitchbook they managed to bash out between 2-3am on a sunday morning etc.

so glad i’m on the buyside

Agreed. Everytime I have checked it out it just seemed like a dick measuring contest.

^between a lot of kids who have no idea wtf they’re talking about, and no idea what life has in store for them.

The thing I’ve always liked about the WC is you have finance-y type people sharing their opinions on varying divergent topics. It is a place to debate with people who are like-minded and have similiar (but different, as finance is very diverse) training as yourself. I always find that interesting. Along with quality posts by people like Bromion, who don’t post as much what to invest in but how to view investments. And CvM who posts a lot of satirical quality stuff, just have to figure out the point he is getting to ha ha

The thing I’ve always liked about the WC is you have finance-y type people sharing their opinions on varying divergent topics. It is a place to debate with people who are like-minded and have similiar (but different, as finance is very diverse) training as yourself. I always find that interesting. Along with quality posts by people like Bromion, who don’t post as much what to invest in but how to view investments. And CvM who posts a lot of satirical quality stuff, just have to figure out the point he is getting to ha ha