^ Don’t forget their sig!
Of course Quebec can have some stars (Stella Jones is one I’ve owned in the past, as is Couche-Tard). There is still a negative overall environment for business there. It’s high tax, unless you are the political favourite. It’s heavily unionised. It’s politically unstable. Some people believe another referendum could happen (it won’t). These are negatives.
But back to the case in question. Bombardier was (and really still is) a government ward for years. You don’t think some loyalties are owed? The government has provided billions in loans and guarntees. That’s not something that Stella, Couche-Tard or Metro have hanging over their heads. It’s fundamentally different. I’d be very relucant to invest in a company that is so tied to a government that has a track record of corruption that would make Italy or Spain look reasonable. SNC and BBD are not the same as SJ and CGO.
And it’s not like there are different people at the helm now than the last few times it was run into the ground and bailed out. It’s the same family. Just a rotating group of marriages and in laws switching chairs here and there. Nothing has changed. And their performance has been terrible. In any other firm they’d be run out of town. But not with BBD. Why? Because the firm needs them to bring the government money in order to keep functioning.
Here is a Macleans read about the environment in which Bombardier operates in and the government that supports it: http://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/the-most-corrupt-province/
And here is a Huff Post read about Bombardier’s reliance on their Quebecois political friends: http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/mark-milke/bombardier-corporate-welfare-trap_b_4705751.html
Those are the old school Quebecois politicos I am refering to. There are great Quebecois and Quebecers are there are anywhere and in any jurisdiction. I won’t put my money with those tied to or reliant on the government in that province though.
I don’t hate Quebecois… my heritage is half Quebecois, and old Quebecois to boot, tracing back to the early 1700’s. There is an electoral district in Quebec named after my family (not just the same name, but actually my relative). I’m not being an intolerant Western anglophone. This is not about hating Quebec. I just don’t like businesses that are closely tied to regimes that operate like Quebec’s has over the last several decades. And BBD in particular has been run by the same people forever, people that can’t drive any success.
My two cents. I don’t have anything else to contribute. Just my opinion. I probably won’t say much more because apparently I’m coming across as I’m anti-Quebec zealot.
i always liked canadians. wht are some good beers to try? i assume molson and labat are junk?
Bombardier is a player in countries strapped for cash ? Have you ever travelled in western Europe ?
Quebec is not a business-friendly environment ? Again, have you ever travelled outside of North America ?
On the whole government thing : again, this is the infrastructure business we’re talking about, right ? How can you even compare them with retailers ?
I don’t care if you are an anti-Quebec zealot or if you have québécois lineage ; you do sound like the typical obtuse North-American who calls every country socialist and who discards any model which isn’t the one he is used to. Québec is slightly different society where the state bears a greater role. Yes, this is how we do things. But so does most of Europe as well. Almost all Québec-bashing could apply to Europe, you know.
You do come across as anti-Quebec, maybe it’s the Sun News influence.
Pierre Peladeau uses his Quebecor platform in Quebec to thrash anglos and his Sun platform in the West to thrash francos. It makes him money and serves his political interests.
Speaking of Bombardier, it has threatened to leave Quebec after a backlash with the Quebec Order of Engineers.
Extensively. Most of those countries are implementing austerity programs impacting their expenditures on things like new trains and street cars.
I didn’t.
If you’ve read my posts on this forum elsewhere, you’d know I’m quite left wing by this forums standards. I have great respect for the German, Dutch, Belgian and even French systems (they aren’t perfect, but I like their social responsibility). The difference between those countries and Quebec is realism and sustainability. Quebec could not offer what they do without massive subsidy from the rest of Canada. Transfer payments keep that socialist dream afloat. That’s not the case in, say, Germany, where they have created a self sustaining model with good social outcomes. So no, I’m not against other models. In fact, I wouldn’t mind my own province adopting some of Quebec’s ideas. But to call Quebec a model economy is silly. It exists the way it does only because of Canada’s federalism. And to FT - I don’t read the Sun.
did you tools not read my post?
Molson and Labatt are junk. Big Rock makes some good beers. I’ve been impressed with some microbrews from Okanagan Brewing lately too. But good luck finding any of these in the US. FT and Viceroy probably enjoy a good Fin du Monde from time to time. Speaking of, Don de Dieu is a good wheat beer surprisingly from Quebec. The Quebec beers don’t disappoint in strength, we are talking >9% for Don de Dieu (and I think more for Fin du Monde but I don’t have any in my fridge to check).
Whatever, all I’m gonna say is Poutine is reason enough to love Quebec. #becausecheesecurds
Geo,
Quebec is absolutely in line with the canadian average / inhabitant under the federal transfer system.
In any case these transfers do not even account for roughly 3 % of Quebec’s GDP.
How much money do you believe leaves Quebec in federal taxes anyways ?
^^
I do agree on the beer part however. Quebec beers tend to be pretty strong, a good example being the Fin du Monde.
It is a very good beer, crafted following the belgian abbey tradition. For some reason, many beers in Quebec remind of belgian beers (although I am not claiming that they can beat a Westmalle, Rochefort, Chimay, or even a Kwack). I would say that the Fin du Monde is comparable in quality to a Leffe (at least the one with that fushia bottle sticker).
EDIT : on wheat beers : I hate that shit. That’s almost all they drink in Bavaria. Tastes like bread juice or something. Way too thick.
I agree Quebec has many very Belgian tasting beers, ebixh is fantastic. Fin du Monde is a bit much for me to handle though. But why the hate for Weissber or Hefeweizen? I used to be skeptical of it as well, but its really grown on me. A nice Erdinger Dunkel on a summer day. Yum. Great with a nice slab of Alberta beef.
Why the hate ? Because it tastes like sh!t, that’s why.
Naaah just kidding. I am not fond of it because I don’t find it refreshing enough and it has that funny sweet taste.
I have also developed some kind of hate towards it because in some areas of southern Germany it is pretty much the only beer they drink. You won’t be able to get a Pils in some areas of Bavaria.
I do love the bavarian brunch though : white sausages, bretzel, sweet mustard and a Weizen. Delicious.
- you get the bonus of being tipsy (after 2-3 glasses @ 0,5 L) and full right after brunch, which allows for an epic nap.
Are you in Bavaria? Sounds like fun. Need more beer at brunch here…
^^ Yes. They really do have great beer culture here.
I also really like their food, so I gained like 3 Kg since I moved here 
I could honestly eat bretzel and sausage and drink beer all day. Good thing I don’t live there. And interesting that you’re in Bavaria. I didn’t think there was a lot of finance there, nor expat opportunity.
^^^
Well maybe I can tell you a thing or two about Germany, if it interests you.
The thing with Germany is that it is an extremely decentralised country ( I happen to think that it is one of the reasons for Germany’s success).
If you look at the German map :
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the federal administration is in Berlin (North East)
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international activity is very strong in the North (Hamburg, Bremen)
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the most populous region is the West (the big region around the Ruhr)
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industrial activity is concentrated in the South
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financial activity is concentrated in Frankfurt (in the middle), but the German financial landscape is particuliar.
Deutsche Bank and Commerzbank are indeed headquartered in Frankfurt, but there is something in Germany called Landesbanken, which are regional banks that carry out Corporate & Investment Banking activities.
Some of these Landesbanken are major players in the syndicated loans and Schuldschein (pretty much a tradable bank loan) markets, which are a major source of financing for big companies in Germany. Three very important Landesbanken in these markets are the BayernLB, LBBW and NordLB, located in Munich, Stuttgart and Hannover respectively.
You also have some very old white shoe investment banks like MM Warburg and Berenberg, both located in Hamburg.
What I mean to say is that there is a lot of finance outside of Frankfurt in Germany.
Lastly, despite a concentration in Frankfurt, there are many important PE, mutual funds and asset managers that are located in Munich. Add two global monsters named Allianz and Munich Re that are headquartered in Munich and yes, Bavaria is an important place for finance in Germany.
^ Interesting stuff. I love Bavaria and really enjoyed Munich. I’m keeping my eyes open for some global opportunities and destinations to give my kid some international perspective growing up in a few years (maybe a couple years of living in Europe) so this is great info. I’m assuming you’re fluent German?