Is there a list in investments on which are the “Top 20” or “Top 10?” In the future if I choose financing as an industry after training, I wouldn’t want to accidentally apply to any of these super-elite unless I have done something worth noticing. Since I’ve heard many experiences on this forum where people rip you apart if you have a “bad application” I think it would be effecient to know who is and who isn’t the hoi-poloi elite. If anyone has there own list, I’d be intrested to hear that also. Thanks Everybody!
FYI: “hoi polloi” refers to the many; often referring to the dregs of society, not the elite.
SergeLang Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Is there a list in investments on which are the > “Top 20” or “Top 10?” In the future if I choose > financing as an industry after training, I > wouldn’t want to accidentally apply to any of > these super-elite unless I have done something > worth noticing. Since I’ve heard many experiences > on this forum where people rip you apart if you > have a “bad application” I think it would be > effecient to know who is and who isn’t the > hoi-poloi elite. > > If anyone has there own list, I’d be intrested to > hear that also. > > Thanks Everybody! I completely realize this is unhelpful, but I don’t see why you wouldn’t apply because it was elite, what’s the harm in setting your sights high? I also don’t see why people use the phrase hoi-polloi to mean elite… McThorp beat me to it.
It has gained the usage of meaning the “elite,” I believe even the OED aknowledges that. I’m not intrested in a discussion of etymology at this point. We’re all very proud of your knowledge mcthorpe. BTW: It’s been used to also mean “the great ons.” Too bad that wasn’t on the wikipedia article either :-p.
"I completely realize this is unhelpful, but I don’t see why you wouldn’t apply because it was elite, what’s the harm in setting your sights high? I also don’t see why people use the phrase hoi-polloi to mean elite… " Because, if I havn’t done anything to justify my position there, then it would be a waste of time to apply. As people say “time is money,” and if I can avoid several dead ends, tha’ts time saved for me. In any event, what is the usual background of a succesful applicant? Unlike graduate/professional school, these companies don’t post what their looking for concretely… instead using vague statements like “Creativity,” etc.
Serge - What exactly are you asking? I think what you really want to know is who has the best reputation in the finance world for stellar output, but are you looking at the entire “financial” universe? That encompasses a lot of various sectors - banks, investment banks, private equity, hedge funds, asset management firms, insurance companies, public pension plans, REITs, etc. You are looking at “financing” as a possible career choice - what exactly do you mean by that? Do you think you want to work in corporate finance (as I would conclude from such language)? In terms of investment banks there is an obvious list of the top firms that are commonly referred to as Bulge Bracket firms. Beyond that there are Middle Market firms that may have a better reputation in specific areas than their larger peers, but you really have to be specific in terms of what you are referring to in order to get someone to answer such a vague question as “What are the ‘Top 20’ in Investment?”
Actually, I wouldn’t mind a guide to the middle market firms - not necessarily a ranking, but just a list of maybe 20-50 well respected middle and even boutique asset management shops, with maybe a bullet point or two on what their specialty/differentiating factor is. The bulge bracket houses have recognizable names, but a list like that could really help target my networking efforts.
Actually bchadwick I don’t even know what the top 20 “bulge” firms are. Is tehre a list of these firms at least? I presume since you don’t even know a 20 - 50 list, that such a list does not exist or is not readily available.
Use Google… There is a book by John Train called “The great investors of our time” or something like that. Search for his name in amazon. I read it a while back it has chapters on many great investors, their backgrounds and investment philosophies. I think that is what you’re looking for, but you were vague so I’m not sure.
Google ‘league tables’ this may be a good place to start w/ a list of names.
Bulge Bracket investment banks are simply those that most often do deals for the largest firms (think S&P 500/1000): Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley, Merrill Lynch, CSFB, Lehman Brothers, Citigroup, Deutsche Bank, UBS and J P Morgan generally make this list. Middle Market IBs are those that compete for deals with the remaining mid-size and small firms, and are sometimes referred to as Boutique IBs. They are simply the other IBs that are not BB. A list of top MM IBs would be subjective, as they make up the majority of the IB firms, and each specializes in different areas. You would need to determine what area of finance and industry you are interested in and delve a little deeper to determine your own list. I wouldn’t limit your career search to those firms that don’t make the top of your list: you want to start your finance career with a company as high up the list as you can because you will end up being more able to switch banks laterally versus working your way UP the list.
SergeLang Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Is there a list in investments on which are the > “Top 20” or “Top 10?” In the future if I choose > financing as an industry after training, I > wouldn’t want to accidentally apply to any of > these super-elite unless I have done something > worth noticing. Since I’ve heard many experiences > on this forum where people rip you apart if you > have a “bad application” I think it would be > effecient to know who is and who isn’t the > hoi-poloi elite. > > If anyone has there own list, I’d be intrested to > hear that also. > > Thanks Everybody! If you want to get the best start you can, you should probably shoot for a job at one of the banks previously listed. That will give you the experience you need to start figuring out what precise career path you want to take in the industry. My guess from your previous post would be to look for jobs in departments like Quantitative Research/Risk Management or possibly even Prop Trading. In terms of figuring out what jobs to apply for Wilmott.com would probably be a good resource for a guy in your shoes. To polish your resume, your school’s Career Center is probably a good start; however, to do a good job you should also network, and find someone with the EXACT job you want ten years down the road and have them look at what you’ve written. Also, keep a close eye on your career center to keep track of events companies may have on campus… I hope this wasn’t too basic…
I wouldn’t think i’d be competetive for the top 20. My Masters GPA so-far is close to 4.0 in Mathematics, but my UG GPA got screwed up in my super senior year of party-all-day and being a douche. I am currently working on a reserach paper, and my prof tells me he thinks it’ll be published in a good journal. Although the paper is in pure mathematics, not applied, so I’m sure they won’t care about it. Do they look at test scores? I scored extremely high in both of my graduate entrance exams (for mathematics and the GRE). I was thinking of taking of trying to publish some resarch in Options Theory after I take that course next semester. I’ll have that and the basic Mathematical Finance and Stochastic Calculus done after next semseter, so if I can get a feelf or the literature from now to then, I could start working on something more applied (right now if I take classes straight-through with no-break i should graduate with my masters in Mathematics and Quant finance. in 1 1/2 years). I’m probably far from the ideal candidate, since i have absolutely no experience. But I’ve also been toying with the idea of doing an internship as a “entry-level” goverment economist. If I do that, I’ll have to forestall my studies a half-year to year… I’m still wondering whether the trade-off is worth it. Many people tell me that my lack of experience will prevent me from entering any market other then continue to pursue academia… which I havn’t written off completely either. The reason I asked for mid-range firms is cause I would probably ahve more of a realistic chance with these firms. I try to be practical, and not dive into flights of fancy or unrealistic reaches. I’ve always done that, and it’s worked for me so far.
You actually have a very specific career path as you’re doing a quantative Masters, so Wilmott.com will be a better place for you to guage what the market is like for a guy in your shoes. They’ll know much more about what the career path is and how to get your first job…
Thanks ahahah. I appreciate this advice greatly!
Look up the highest-earning traders of 2007 in trader monthly. Their shops are elite. SergeLang Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Is there a list in investments on which are the > “Top 20” or “Top 10?” In the future if I choose > financing as an industry after training, I > wouldn’t want to accidentally apply to any of > these super-elite unless I have done something > worth noticing. Since I’ve heard many experiences > on this forum where people rip you apart if you > have a “bad application” I think it would be > effecient to know who is and who isn’t the > hoi-poloi elite. > > If anyone has there own list, I’d be intrested to > hear that also. > > Thanks Everybody!
My best advice is that if you want to be an elite investor, whatever you do, try not to hoi-polloi yourself.