Advice on beating a speeding ticket in court

Does anybody have any good advice on how to beat a speeding ticket in court? I am hoping the cop doesnt show up. The fine is around 150, but im more worried about the 4 pts on my record. Im under 25 so the points could really jack up the insurance. I have a perfect record thus far. Story below:

I was driving in a Southern state, it was early in the morning (dark and rainy). I came around a bend and the cop was sitting in the shoulder getting into his car. He was sitting on the entrance ramp and pulled me over on the exit ramp. He told me he saw me going 70 in a 55. He was pretty accurate. He told me why he pulled me over, I never admitted any guilt. I was very polite and did as he asked.

If he does show up I was hoping to just try and pay the fine and work out a deal where it doesn’t go on my record if i dont get another ticket in 6 months. I wont be home for a while, so I dont mind taking a deal like that. I already moved the court date so hopefully he will just not show. Appreciate and advice and/or stories.

Tell them you did not notice the speed sign as it was very dark.

Read this thread here: http://www.analystforum.com/comment/91103512

I have received two speeding tickets in my life – one where I pleaded no contest, and one where I represented myself in court without an attorney. As some of you may have noticed by now, I put a lot of value on experiential learning in my life, because I think it is the best way to get up the learning curve.

Ultimately, I ended up presenting as strong of a case that I could have reasonably provided, and although the judge ruled that I was guilty of speeding (something about 80 mph in a 60 mph zone), I did not get any points on my driving record and actually my fine was reduced from around $280 to just $160. Most curiously, I was commended by one of the members of the prosecution after the trial for my confidence and preparation.

How did I get to this point? Check the link I posted – there’s a lot of good advice in that thread, especially the site called “Fighting a speeding ticket.” Beyond that, here’s my advice to you. First, there are a number of details you should investigate during the discovery process (pay attention because you’re only afforded a certain number of days to request certain details) – these details include radar repair records, calibration logs, patrol car (cops often switch cars), maintenance records, and so forth. You have a constitutional right to discovery and so you should start building your case before you actually go to court.

On the day of the trial, you’ll probably be nervous and flustered just as I was. However, you will also go a long way by being respectful, confident and humble – I’ll say this again later, but you don’t want to piss off the judge. He/she will know you’re green, so you’ll get a lot more love if you’ve studied the books and know what you’re supposed to do ahead of time (i.e. do NOT go into a courtroom without having a clue about legal protocol, especially if you plan to go in without an attorney!). Oh yeah, about attire – you know your “Sunday best”? That isn’t just for the church. That’s also for the courtroom. If you want respect from the judge and prosecution, dress like you deserve it.

The trial started with the prosecution’s opening statement and presentation of the case (I declined to provide an opening statement and felt this was the right strategy), followed by the cop’s testimony and video of my alleged speeding. All of this proceeded as expected. Things started to get interesting during my cross-examination of the cop. I asked him for specific details about whether he could recall what car he was driving that day (fully knowing that cops often switch cars, he didn’t remember), when he had his pacer last calibrated (he didn’t recall), and a few other things where I tried to expose inconsistencies between what was learned through the discovery process and his testimony on that day. I also asked the cop to approximate how far he had been pacing me and at what rate and distance he accelerated, knowing that the day I had been cited for the ticket was six months earlier and I didn’t think it was particularly likely that the cop would remember the details of my case, or even be able to come up with details that were mathematically close to what the laws of physics would provide.

Basically, what I’m saying is that if you’re somewhat adept at math and can be confident in your ability to calculate distance, rate, time, and acceleration where all but one of those variables are unknown, you can quite possibly prove that the cop’s assertion as to how fast you were driving based on the time he allegedly was pacing you will not necessarily add up – and any time you can create doubt in the prosecution’s case, that can only be a good thing for you.

The hardest part of the day was knowing when to object during the cop’s/prosecution’s case. I’d say the objections I used most frequently were based on independent recollection, narrative and speculation. It’s tough because if you’ve never been inside a courtroom before, you have no idea when you’re supposed to object and you don’t want to piss off the judge. But that’s why upfront preparation helps.

My trial came and went in 45 minutes, and all went as I had hoped except for the verdict as I mentioned earlier: guilty. Personally, I feel like the verdict had more to do with circumstantial evidence and just the general fact that the judge, prosecution and cop all knew each other. I’m not saying that the American court system is corrupt or anything because we have one of the best court systems in the world. Maybe I was speeding that day after all. But what’s really important is that I got my fine reduced, I didn’t get any points on my license, and ultimately I would feel completely confident representing myself in a court of law if I were to get another speeding ticket in the future.

Anyway, I wish you the best of luck. Let us know how you decide to proceed.

P.S. I do not endorse speeding and any of my recommendations per the above are based on my own opinion and experiences. They are intended to be within the complete purview of the law. Your moves may vary.

Driving too fast for conditions.

Do you speak any foreign languages?

Whenever I get pulled over I pull out an old Russian ID that I have (it’s actually a student ID card). I speak Russian to the cop and smile. After about 30 seconds they tell me to slow down and let me go.

I received a speeding ticket in 2007. My driving record was clean prior to that point and I have not received another ticket since that time. I was driving 75 mph in a 55 mph zone, which is uncharacteristic of my behavior as a driver. Nonetheless, I was in the wrong. The 20 mph over citation would have nearly doubled my insurance rates (11-19 mph would have been much less severe), so I showed up on my scheduled court date hoping for some leniency. I wore a suit, apologized for my behavior, plead no contest, and asked that the judge and state prosecutor consider mitigating the charges. They reduced the charge to 19 mph and cut the fine and points in half. My insurance rates did not increase after this incident.

Its all about admitting guilt. Now that you have already plead not guilty just go to court and apologize for your mistake and say you will not do it again. Try to be sincere and apologetic, that’s all they are looking for…

Been there, done that several times now and I have not gotten a single point on my license. Some states do make you pay the huge fine though (fking Jersey).

They are not looking for you to defend your case and waste their time. I got a speeding ticket in upstate NY once and the cop flat out told me that ticketing is a revenue generating business for them so just plead guilty and they will remove the points. I did exactly that, and got a letter in the mail with a ‘reduced’ offense but $300 penalty.

Find the prosecutor in the hall before your scheduled time and cut a deal. 90% chance he’ll scrap the points and just hit you with a fine. As ZB said, it’s all about the money.

The only way to be sure is to get it fixed. What these guys above have said may work, but it’s not sure fire. Get a lawyer and he/she will get it reduced to a non-moving violation. It’ll cost you though. If the ticket is $150 count on $350-400 in fees. But, no points and insurance is none the wiser.

^ What they said. As a brotha, I’m a certified paralegal. Go to court for your first appearance and say, “Look, what can we work out today to make us all happy.” Most of the time they will say, “Pay a fine, don’t do it again, and it’ll stay off your record.” If they don’t take that bait, which would be a dick move, then lawyer up.

If you show up guns blazing, it may not work in your favor while you spend a ton on legal representation. So show up solo, dressed nice, and apologize. If that doesn’t work, then get lawyer. Try it.

Hell, call the prosecutor’s office today and ask if you can talk to someone about your ticket. If they tell you to bugger off, then take Sweep’s advice and get a lawyer. More likely than not though, the prosecutor will cut you a no points deal and tell you to stop by his office to make it official. They don’t want to waste the judge or police officer’s time if you’re willing to pony up a few bills.

Does the state not offer a probation option? A few states I have had tickets in do and you could do prob, pay the fine, and if you dont get in trouble in 90 days (no other tickets in the county), it stays off the record. You may have to take defensive driving or something.

I agree with CFAvMBA and others advice once you get the ticket. I once went to court and showed the judge a picture of a tree completely covering the speed limit sign I was supposed to have violated and I got the same deal I would have received had I just dealt with the prosecutor in the beginning.

If you want to get out of the ticket, the best time to do it is when the cop first pulls you over. If you talk yourself into a warning, then it’s pretty much no biggie. I’ve talked myself into two warnings. The first it was like 3-4am and I was easily doing like 30 over. Cop pulls me over asks me how fast I was going, I say I think I was going the speed limit (never admit you are going over the speed limit because that’s admitting guilt, no excuse to give you a warning) but I’ve been driving for 8 hours so I could have missed a sign. He let me off with a warning and told me to pull up to a rest stop and sleep, which I ignored. I think he was patrolling for DUIs rather than speeders, which helped. The second they got me coming around a curve (like OP). Whenever you’re pulled over and the cop isn’t directly behind or in front of you, it can help to resort to physics/trig. http://copradar.com/preview/chapt2/ch2d1.html

Best solution is to go to Venezuela and lay low until you can get some new papers made.

I doubt that the judge will really follow all these trigonometry/physics arguments. They probably just offer you a deal so you go away and they can do other things.

^Never tried it against a judge, but it has worked against cops for me.

If you want to prove how smart you are and be able to brag to your friends about how you overwhelmed the legal system with your brilliance, go ahead and bust out your Cray so you can demonstrate how the alignment of the planets and atmospheric conditions at that time, on that day, and at the particular longitude and latitude makes it impossible for the police to have estimated your speed with an acceptable level accuracy.

If you want to trade a couple of bucks for ditching the points, just contact the f’ing prosecutor and be done with it.

http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/california-physicist-beats-traffic-ticket-mathematical-proof/story?id=16150993

Dmitri Krioukov, a physicist at the University of California, San Diego, was pulled over for jumping a stop sign. The fine would have been $400. But Krioukov tried something that most traffic courts probably haven’t seen: He wrote an academic paper to argue why he ought to be found not guilty. Its title: “The Proof of Innocence.”

The judge chose not to fight him. Next case, please.

But Physics Central, which first reported this story, says Krioukov concluded with a challenge: “I want to ask the readership to please find the flaw in the argument.”

All good advice. I’m going to contact the prosecutor and see if i can pay the fine and take probation or no points. It will save me from having to travel down there. Now i just have to find the contact info for the prosecutor which could be a nightmare.

Or maybe not:

Superior Court Commissioner Karen Riley told U-T San Diego that she listened to the physics argument but much of it went over her head.

“The ruling was not based on his physics explanation,” Riley told the San Diego paper. “It was based on the officer’s view … The officer wasn’t close enough to the intersection to have a good view.”