This is the worst thing that is happening to wall street after the ‘boiler room’
Neud Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Why do you guys see any problems with the bonuses? > The more the market pays, the more other companies > will pay. So given we (well, most of us at this > forum) work in investment-related businesses, we > are better off if market participants pay good > bonuses. I think you need to take this into consideration: many of us out there have individuals as clients somewhere along the food chain. If these individuals do not have faith in the markets, asset management, etc, they will not give us their money. Right now the average person wants nothing to do with the market and does not trust it to be fair. Ask anyone how much they are now investing or plan to invest in their 401K…If your AUM are diminishing, so is your future bonuses and jobs…there is a domino effect across the whole industry. Putting aside ethical considerations, it is in the best long term interest of all of us to bring back trust…and these continued bonus payments to those accepting federal funds is not helping…especially this AIG disaster.
gaffano Wrote: > I think you need to take this into consideration: > many of us out there have individuals as clients > somewhere along the food chain. If these > individuals do not have faith in the markets, > asset management, etc, they will not give us their > money. Right now the average person wants nothing > to do with the market and does not trust it to be > fair. Ask anyone how much they are now investing > or plan to invest in their 401K…If your AUM are > diminishing, so is your future bonuses and > jobs…there is a domino effect across the whole > industry. > > Putting aside ethical considerations, it is in the > best long term interest of all of us to bring back > trust…and these continued bonus payments to > those accepting federal funds is not > helping…especially this AIG disaster. This is pathetic. I would never ever sacrifice my bonus in order to “bring back trust”, the government (actually, many governments accross the globe) and heads of leading institutions should undertake certain measures to bring back trust. Unless they do it (and do it properly), my own bonus sacrifice would make NO difference. But if they do it, then the trust will also gradually return - again notwithstanding my personal bonus amount.
sublimity Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > “mob justice” is justified when the “mob” is who > you are stealing from Perhaps you as well wouldn’t mind rolling back the societal clock a few hundred years??? I am probably more heated by the whole auto bailout BS than this, but you don’t see me going around saying off with Gettlefingers head do you? So many here and elsewhere fail to see that Government did have a hand in this as well. Not the bonuses, but no real provisions were given to AIG before they recieved TARP funds. You can’t expect anyone to do the right thing out of the kindness of their hearts, it has to be instilled or put on an incentives basis. I’ve just about had it with Govt. pointing all the fingers at everyone else, it is def. fair to say they also are responsible for this mess. In summary Wall St. got drunk, but who the heck do you think was serving the liquor??? Comon, use your brain for a second and stop getting so emotional. Pop a midol if you have to. Sheesh.
I can’t believe you used “Sheesh” in a sentence. You know the world is coming to an end when people use that word.
Neud Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > gaffano Wrote: > > I think you need to take this into > consideration: > > many of us out there have individuals as > clients > > somewhere along the food chain. If these > > individuals do not have faith in the markets, > > asset management, etc, they will not give us > their > > money. Right now the average person wants > nothing > > to do with the market and does not trust it to > be > > fair. Ask anyone how much they are now > investing > > or plan to invest in their 401K…If your AUM > are > > diminishing, so is your future bonuses and > > jobs…there is a domino effect across the > whole > > industry. > > > > Putting aside ethical considerations, it is in > the > > best long term interest of all of us to bring > back > > trust…and these continued bonus payments to > > those accepting federal funds is not > > helping…especially this AIG disaster. > > This is pathetic. I would never ever sacrifice my > bonus in order to “bring back trust”, the > government (actually, many governments accross the > globe) and heads of leading institutions should > undertake certain measures to bring back trust. > Unless they do it (and do it properly), my own > bonus sacrifice would make NO difference. But if > they do it, then the trust will also gradually > return - again notwithstanding my personal bonus > amount. Neud…if you were one of the people in AIG structured products who’s reckless and extremely risky decisions basically brought the company to its knees, who had to be given mouth to mouth, who lost so much shareholder value, and arguably who had a great deal to do with this financial collapse,… you would not feel bad about taking such a high level of compensation? Sure the politicians share some fault, but give me a break. Maybe I am different, but if I did under these circumstances, I would not be able to look myself in the mirror. I hope for all of our sakes there are more people with this frame of thought in our business, especially those in the CFA program.
Gaffano, I am not ready to answer you from the position of potential MD’s/leading traders who were the decision makers in these transactions. Talking from my own standpoint - the one of IB associate, who actually does a lot of hard work and is not in charge of making key decisions - I wouldn’t even think about considering the slightest possibility of sacrificing whatever portion of my bonus
sublimity Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I can’t believe you used “Sheesh” in a sentence. > > You know the world is coming to an end when people > use that word. CVS run out of your vagisil?
CFABLACKBELT Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > sublimity Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > I can’t believe you used “Sheesh” in a > sentence. > > > > You know the world is coming to an end when > people > > use that word. > > > CVS run out of your vagisil? I just use your mom to get my dose.
We all know there are many associates out there over the last 8 years who were paid great bonuses for creating so called value,…value that often turned out not to exist, and in many cases, was actually destruction. Does not matter how hard these people worked. They should be happy they got away with it for so long and that clawbacks are unrealistic…
gaffano Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > We all know there are many associates out there > over the last 8 years who were paid great bonuses > for creating so called value,…value that often > turned out not to exist, and in many cases, was > actually destruction. > > Does not matter how hard these people worked. They > should be happy they got away with it for so long > and that clawbacks are unrealistic… If I worked for AIG, I would be happy just to have a job at the moment. But if the government is stupid enough to hand me a check for a million dollar, I would never give it back, no questions about that. You have to admire the way democracies work, in many other countries, these guys would be running scared, but in the US, Congress, which represents the people and has the authority to issue new laws, got together and found a way to correct the mistake “we’ll tax your a** at the highest level allowed by law, if you have a problem go spend your bonus on an attorney and later on a CPA to help you with the IRS audits that will for sure come your way for the rest of your life b**ch” … Facing this possible scenario, I would probably return the money or move out the country for ever.
It just crossed my screen that they passed a bill taxing these bonuses and others at 90%. I can tell you one thing, this carefully thought out, well put together piece of legislation will have no unintended consequences whatsoever.
There are probably ways around future issues, like maybe just eliminating the term “bonus” and just paying a high salary. The report I saw said that anyone with incomes over 250K would be taxed at 90% of bonus.
This whole bonus outrage is why socialism sucks. It never stops at just government funding of institutions - next thing there is a maximum wage and no bonuses, until everybody is forced to pick beets for 2 weeks every summer to do their civic duty, come out to the parades with signs and watch programs about dairy collective farms on black and white TVs.