ten bucks says if you get a job somewhere else without asking the guy the next time he sees you he’ll say “You know I run a PE shop, right? Why didn’t you give me a call?”
Black Swan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Danny Boy Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > adehbone Wrote: > > > -------------------------------------------------- > > > ----- > > > Going through family/friends, is no different > > than > > > the Harvard kid using his powerful alumni or > a > > > frat connection. The random draw/selection > for > > > resumes in finance, makes having connections > a > > key > > > would say its far from lazy. > > > > I’m not disagreeing with your post in general, > but > > using family connections that you’re born with > is > > quite a bit different than being accepted into > one > > of the top institutions through hard-work and > then > > leveraging that network into an offer. > > > You’re making the naive assumption that everyone > who goes to Harvard got there through hardwork on > their own merit. Frankly, I think this discussion > has gotten really really polarized with people > getting very personal in their attacks on others, > making naive assumptions about a meritocratic > world in which we do not live and taking full > responsibility for everything they’ve ever > accomplished from their soapbox while I’m sure > they’re ignoring the fact that everyone who wasn’t > born in Africa with no limbs or living parents has > some unfair advantage over someone else. I didn’t make an assumption. I was commenting on a difference between someone who earned something (the Harvard network through being accepted due to hard work) and being born with something. I didn’t say everyone went to Harvard got there through hard work. So, which naive assumption are you referring to?
Because he stated that getting in through friends / family was no different from someone getting in through a Harvard alumni / frat connection, you disagreed and gave reasoning which carried an embedded assumption. I pointed it out…dumb@ss
topher Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > If you’re willing to work for free it may not be > all that difficult. Just ask for an introduction > and state your intentions. Obviously it depends on > his personality and what he thinks about this kind > of hook up. Are there people out there that are willing to work for free? They must live at their parents home then! That is shocking to me.
Black Swan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Because he stated that getting in through friends > / family was no different from someone getting in > through a Harvard alumni / frat connection, you > disagreed and gave reasoning which carried an > embedded assumption. I pointed it out…dumb@ss I see your point, but my post was self-contained in that I defined the subject clearly to demonstrate there are difference between earning something and being born with it. However, even if you’re correct and it was an assumption, was it a naive one? Do you actually think most student at Harvard are there because of connections instead of impressive applications?
Danny Boy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Black Swan Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Because he stated that getting in through > friends > > / family was no different from someone getting > in > > through a Harvard alumni / frat connection, you > > disagreed and gave reasoning which carried an > > embedded assumption. I pointed it > out…dumb@ss > > I see your point, but my post was self-contained > in that I defined the subject clearly to > demonstrate there are difference between earning > something and being born with it. > > However, even if you’re correct and it was an > assumption, was it a naive one? Do you actually > think most student at Harvard are there because of > connections instead of impressive applications? I think the Harvard candidate pool is pretty impressive. I also think that selection from among that pool is not based primarily on merits, but often on less achievement based characteristics. I mean Bush Jr went to HBS based on roughly a C average at Yale. Yes, I’m sure this is quite the exception by degree of just how bad he did in undergrad and how famous his dad was. However, I’m sure a great deal of your accepted applicants to top pools may be slightly less achieved, but slightly more connected. Even to get into undergrad, do you really think your level of achievement by the time your 18 is predominately your own and not your parents putting you on a road to success?
Black Swan Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I think the Harvard candidate pool is pretty > impressive. I also think that selection from > among that pool is not based primarily on merits, > but often on less achievement based > characteristics. I mean Bush Jr went to HBS based > on roughly a C average at Yale. Yes, I’m sure > this is quite the exception by degree of just how > bad he did in undergrad and how famous his dad > was. However, I’m sure a great deal of your > accepted applicants to top pools may be slightly > less achieved, but slightly more connected. Even > to get into undergrad, do you really think your > level of achievement by the time your 18 is > predominately your own and not your parents > putting you on a road to success? Here’s an interesting thought. Perhaps George W. Bush was not admitted based on his academic prowess (C avg at Yale and whatnot), and not even to reward him for his political connections (at least not directly). From the perspective of Harvard, the advantage may be so that everyone else that was admitted based on merit might be able to benefit from W’s political connections. From that perspective, it is a net positive decision for Harvard. Yay, leadership. (jk)
I’m just playing devil’s advocate, but Bush Jr went on to become POTUS. I think HBS made a good decision.
Good point. That’s supposed to be a position which demands a lot of leadership skills.
I still think GW was put there so other people could control him. If this were true, too much leadership would also be bad. So maybe he has what I will call the optimal level of leadership.
bchadwick Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Good point. That’s supposed to be a position > which demands a lot of leadership skills. you mean ‘decidership’ skills
i’ve always looked at those schools (ivy, julliard, etc.) as accepting those with the most potential. often candidates are accepted for demonstrating exceptionalism in whatever base categories there are (math, science, arts, writing, etc.), but separating themselves from the pack by going above and beyond their surroundings.
thommo77 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Nothing wrong with asking a family member for an > interview opportunity or job. As long as you are > interested in the field, demonstrate how you would > be a great fit, are generally qualified for the > position or field, and motivated, why not? This > is called networking. Totally agree with thommo77…not sure how we got to all the digressions, but this seems like such an easy call. “How to ask a relative for a job in PE…” well, start by asking to learn more about what he does and what excites him as you would in an informational interview, and then close by asking if there are any opportunities at his firm and can put you in touch with others. I’m still scratching my head about how a thread like this can get to four pages.
numi Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I’m still scratching my head about how a thread > like this can get to four pages. It happens because people make comments not related to the OP’s question or rehash what has already been said. 
Actually, if you’re referring to my post, it was an effort to get this thing on topic. I didn’t read much past the first page because the signal-to-noise ratio was so poor.
I’ve got mouths to feed. You bet your as$ I will lehman-lever every resource at my discretion to improve my families position. Probably half of my professional network is through 2 guys a cousin introduced me to. They’ve been instrumental in my career development. I can respect avoiding nepotism, but it won’t sway me in any way. Email the dude to pick his brain (I’d just ask the cousin if she would mind and shell either give you the email or won’t). Then take it from there.
ASSet_MANagement Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > If you don’t get it, then you dont “get it.” > > Finance, at it’s core, is a meritocracy. If you’re > getting the hook up through your family, then > you’re essentially saying; “Ok, I acknowledge that > I wouldn’t have gotten this opportunity on my own > merits, it’s ok, I rode the coat tails of someone > else busting their ass to get to my position.” Finance is not a meritocracy, to say so overlooks the fact that you have to be fairly privileged to have the opportunity to even go to university, much less one that is looked upon favorably by finance recruiters. There is a lot of chance that is involved in simply getting the chance to prove yourself. There are a lot of people on this board who do not realize how lucky they are to be born into families who can influence them positively. All of my extended family either work blue collar jobs or are drug dealers and junkies. If I could I’d reach out in a second to family for career advice.