You keep it going man, you keep those books rolling. You pick up those books you’re going to read and not remember, and you roll man. You get that cerfication, okay. Then you get your masters; then get your master’s masters. Then get your doctorate. You go man, then when everybody says quit, you show them those degrees. When everybody says hey, you’re not working, you’re not making any money, you say look at my degrees and you look at my life. Yeah I’m 52, so what, hate all you want, but I’m smart, I’m so smart, and I’m in school. And these guys are out here making money all these ways, and I’m spending mine to be smart. You know why? Because when I die, buddy, you know what’s going to keep me warm, thats right, those degrees.
LOL Pink, have you had 3 coffee’s already??
nice kanye reference. soooo applicable.
Mr. Pink, You must be a new level 1 candidate who will probably fail. But it is ok you will be making money man.
Its funny how everybody assumes Rydex doesn’t have a job…just because he’s going after multiple certifications… I for one commend him, I would do the same, and go after those 3 certs but I’m probably never going to enter the finance industry without an MBA first…
All three certs are valuable, but I would try to move to an active management shop if possible. CAIA doesn’t add much value to your current role while you are working on putting together index funds.
Hey look if you can get the same work experience and study for these degrees when most peolpe would do other stuff like hitting gym or reading a booketc, then its not going to hurt, there is only upside( in professional life)…However if your work takes a hit, then its hurting you and you should reconsider…And if you’re not working, then you are better of getting a job…This is upto you to evaluate…Good luck, we know you have the hard work and dedication!
Doing almost the same thing and I commend you. There are quite a few (very) decent fund managers and generally ridiculously successful investment professionals out there with that 3-desig combo… and they can’t all be tools as some posters on here would have them out to be by their comments. But yea most Masters in Finance degrees will be completely redundant, with the exception of the (very few) programs out there that take the CFA Charter as pretty well a prerequisite to entrance (Rotman at University of Toronto is the only program of this type I know of). And even then at $55K CAD, that’s more than half of a top-tier MBA, which if you need another certification or degree, will take you much further IMHO.
The amount of studying and work to pass the FRM and CAIA together are around two-all levels of the CFA. Not really two more “degrees”.
Looks like you have it all, like most people said just focus on getting more years of experience. I have learnt the hard way cos for me i thought qualifications is more important than experience. But i find that most employers prefer experience, cos when i finish my degree everyone was like you haven’t got enough experience. Finally got a job in an IB and now studying for my CFA level one exams, and after that take a break and then do an MBA, then i can rest my little head. If you decide to set up the Maths Lab, it will benefit people who are trying to improve their maths, and its funny how u will be fulfilled kowing you are able to help people. Good Luck.
Thank you. Finally some good posts. The maths lab, is real addictive.
I think I disagree with the above posters that say no harm can come of getting more creds. I would find it off-putting if someone had all those qualifications unless they also had a top undergrad degree (with a very high GPA). I would probably assume that you don’t have the mental capacity to absorb and properly understand the volumes of material (b/c very, very few would). I might therefore assume you have self-esteem issues or are trying to make amends for not being very smart. For background, I’ve been involved in recruiting IB analysts and ER analysts, so this is not wholly hypothetical. Obviously, I haven’t been making the ultimate decision (just a few years’ experience), but the point has some validity because I have had some input.
do you think the above qialifications could make up for a poor undergrad ? If for whatever reason your undergrad grades are not an accurate reflection of your abilities .??
Etienne Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I think I disagree with the above posters that say > no harm can come of getting more creds. I would > find it off-putting if someone had all those > qualifications unless they also had a top > undergrad degree (with a very high GPA). I would > probably assume that you don’t have the mental > capacity to absorb and properly understand the > volumes of material (b/c very, very few would). I > might therefore assume you have self-esteem issues > or are trying to make amends for not being very > smart. > > For background, I’ve been involved in recruiting > IB analysts and ER analysts, so this is not wholly > hypothetical. Obviously, I haven’t been making > the ultimate decision (just a few years’ > experience), but the point has some validity > because I have had some input. Don’t take this the wrong way, but since when did recruiting turn into a psychological profile assessment? And you can conclude all that from people who have too many certifications?? I have seen just the opposite, people who go after lots of certifications tend to be the kind of people who love what they are doing (they didn’t just land into finance by fluke or soley for the money), they tend to be the people who can put in the overtime work without complaining, and they are goal oriented. And why would you assume about their mental capacity just like that? Any interviewer who knows how to do his job would test the candidate on his technical knowledge. In fact, someone who has all these certs clearly shows that HE HAS the mental capacity to absorb lots of material.
Rudeboi Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > do you think the above qialifications could make > up for a poor undergrad ? If for whatever reason > your undergrad grades are not an accurate > reflection of your abilities .?? I’m hoping completing the CFA will make up for my avg GPA at an avg school. The rest of the certs I have already voiced my opinion. If I were a lead analyst, PM, I-Banking MD etc. I’d rather hire some kid who did CFA (it’s great because it’s very global and well recognized) but could also talk about real markets because they spent alot of time following them, reading quarterly and annual reports, networking etc. rather than just collecting designations.
CFAMaven Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Etienne Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > I think I disagree with the above posters that > say > > no harm can come of getting more creds. I > would > > find it off-putting if someone had all those > > qualifications unless they also had a top > > undergrad degree (with a very high GPA). I > would > > probably assume that you don’t have the mental > > capacity to absorb and properly understand the > > volumes of material (b/c very, very few would). > I > > might therefore assume you have self-esteem > issues > > or are trying to make amends for not being very > > smart. > > > > For background, I’ve been involved in > recruiting > > IB analysts and ER analysts, so this is not > wholly > > hypothetical. Obviously, I haven’t been making > > the ultimate decision (just a few years’ > > experience), but the point has some validity > > because I have had some input. > > > Don’t take this the wrong way, but since when did > recruiting turn into a psychological profile > assessment? And you can conclude all that from > people who have too many certifications?? > > I have seen just the opposite, people who go after > lots of certifications tend to be the kind of > people who love what they are doing (they didn’t > just land into finance by fluke or soley for the > money), they tend to be the people who can put in > the overtime work without complaining, and they > are goal oriented. > > And why would you assume about their mental > capacity just like that? Any interviewer who knows > how to do his job would test the candidate on his > technical knowledge. In fact, someone who has all > these certs clearly shows that HE HAS the mental > capacity to absorb lots of material. First off, I’m talking in “ceteris paribus” terms, so I wouldn’t show the guy the door for the above (even if it was wholly in my power). I would test his/her technical knowledge and would enjoy doing so. This, I suppose, gets to the crux of the matter: I would hold the candidate to a higher standard, and would be pretty unforgiving about mistakes. This is reasonable: if he or she has all these qualifications, how can they be getting my (reasonable) questions wrong? This would suggest two things (the latter more tenuous, I agree): 1) in his/her mad rush to polish his/her CV, the candidate had lost sight of the big picture - it is LEARNING, not QUALIFICATIONS which matter - and 2) if, despite all this learning, the candidate’s answers are flawed/naive/wrong, then I would infer that he/she is not very bright. To summarise: -A good undergrad would give the rest a little more credibility in my eyes; -Failing that, I expect near-perfection.
CFA_Halifax Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Rudeboi Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > do you think the above qialifications could > make > > up for a poor undergrad ? If for whatever > reason > > your undergrad grades are not an accurate > > reflection of your abilities .?? > > > I’m hoping completing the CFA will make up for my > avg GPA at an avg school. The rest of the certs I > have already voiced my opinion. > > If I were a lead analyst, PM, I-Banking MD etc. > I’d rather hire some kid who did CFA (it’s great > because it’s very global and well recognized) but > could also talk about real markets because they > spent alot of time following them, reading > quarterly and annual reports, networking etc. > rather than just collecting designations. I agree and think it’s a reasonable expectation. In my opinion, with CFA, you have proved some level of aptitude and some (greater) level of dedication. My previous point was - to put it yet another way - if a candidate continues to just gather similar qualifications, this is a waste of time b/c a) you get diminishing returns and b) there is so much to learn about the real investment world.
Somehow I doubt a recruiter is going to test my technical skills with very much depth, let alone enjoy it.
WEll, I just started work a little while back close to month and a half, and we have rectruited 4 analysts who work alongside me and while I did not get to interview them obviously, I saw all their resumes and while interviewing, my boss would drill questions and whoever would have the best understanding would get the job, if you had a 4.0 at Harvard or a 3.3 at some non target college and passed two levels of the CFA…So if your fuamental understanding is strong and you can communicate your intelligence, you get hired…I myself am from UC Davis, passed CFA level 1, and got hired here…Ofcourse, I had good things on my Resume but I was lucky to the extent that I was picked for the 1st round interview from all the qualified applicants…Also my competition in the third round extended to MIT, Princeton, Stanford and Berkeley etc which are the top schools for undergrad in Finance/Math/Economics…I did not beat out all of them because about 1/3rd were hired…The bottom line being- you understand your stuff well, you communicate your understanding, you are in…
etienne, have you even bothered to look at the LOS or curriculum for CAIA, FRM, PRM. the broad brush generalizations you make sound very immature and judgmental to me. not to mention ill-informed. “self esteem” “make amends” are easy words to throw around. but i don’t know if you spend the 1000+ hours learning all the very very good stuff that sits in these programs. one caveat - where i would agree with you, if that was your thesis: if someone just takes these tests to pass 'em, not truly honest to goodness learn. i agree there is overlap between FRM and PRM, but besides that, CAIA CFA FRM/PRM is totally complementary. an MBA doesn’t hold a candle to that combination (for finance work). and wall street is so siloed that there is no freakin way in hell, any 4-5 years of experience will possibly give you the breadth of coverage these programs offer. i’ve met plenty of mile deep finance ‘experienced’ folks with top MBAs, whose pants drop down when i ask them about stuff outside their little silo. and its really a shame and a pity that there are managers out there who insist on over-thinking this whole issue: if someone passed these credentials and truly learned the material (not the pure test takers who barely pass), it can only be a big plus. it shows committment, focus, diligence, intelligence and passion. their undergrad, grad, jobs, etc are complementary insights into their candidature, but don’t take away from it. i would never work for, nor allow anyone to progress to a leadership role, some one who disparages others who put in effort to learn, nor anyone who ‘gets put off’ by those who earn these credentials. it says more about your ego/overconfidence/lack of knowledge and respect for knowledge, than about the committed candidate. sorry mate, you disappoint me with your pathetic attitude towards learning.