Sit: Graduated MBA - Finance in may, Passed all three levels of CFA, no job experience in banking field. Realizing how useless MBA & CFA really are for me. Considering: Doing LL.B/J.D. in business law. Want to know: 1) More salary? 2) Easy to get internships during studies? 3) Businesses will seek me out with additional LL.B/J.D. credentials?
I met an attorney awhile back whom held the LL.something/JD and was a tax litigator. He loved his job and liked being an advocate for HNW people whom despised paying more tax than they were obligated to. He has clients with offshore accounts, enormous family trusts, and shell corporations. He said many rich people walk a fine line when it comes to tax avoidance and tax evasion. It got my wheels turning for pursuing something different. I would imagine a JD may pay off now in financial services since the O man is rumored to have a slew of new regulations in place for financial services. Good job nailing the CFA/MBA likewise.
The legal job market (or at least major parts of it) is in its worst shape in decades right now. There have been massive layoffs and really unprecedented things happening at law firms - Cravath, Swaine & Moore, one of the whitest- of white-shoe law firms, deferred its incoming associate class for a year and is not hiring summer associates next summer, for example. If there is another industry whose job market is as bad as finance’s right now, it’s probably business law’s.
where did you get your MBA from?
Nowhere special. JMSB in Montreal.
Forget about finding a finance job in Montreal, even with a MBA and CFA. The industry is too small for the amount of graduates.
For the next 5 years I don’t expect many companies to be willing to hire an inexperienced MBA/CFA graduate, despite that knowledge I have about finance. Montreal is literally a joke regarding financial job openings and language. So I am considering gong into a profession that is English-speaking and can hopefully make me more specialized and sought-after - Law. But I need input about that before I jump in.
so many kids doing law right now and the worst law job market in decades…
black ops, have you considered doing internships in finance? Haven’t you already created a body of work since you’ve done the MBA? Research reports, your own investment models, manage your own portfolio, etc.?
Before spending another 3 years and $$$, why don’t you make the effort to network and knock on doors. If MBA+CFA doesn’t work, it prob. means being unemployed has nothing to do with capability but opportunity - something you can’t get by studying. Besides, getting a law degree gets you no closer to banking/finance than the MBA/CFA that you already got.
A body of work, right. If my MBA told me how to create a body of work, I would have most definitely done so. As it stands now I do not know how to write an equity analysis report. I know all about equity but I don’t know how to write a report about it all. I have called and e-mailed many financial boutiques (40) asking for time to speak with them and if they have opportunities for internships. None of them have any interest in hiring me. The standard responses I get are “We do not have the facilitate to accommodate an internship right now”. Anyways, this thread is not about me complaining or answering questions about how useless the MBA and CFA are for me or what I have/have not done to try and get a job. Rest assured I have tried hard. It’s obvious that the finance profession does not deem my skills valuable. So I am considering other alternatives.
black_ops I feel your pain. Master’s and CFA here, currently employed by the sole remaining bond guarantor in the market but due to the demise of Strucrtured Finance there is no future, here or anywhere (so it seems). It’s as if the labor market has deemed my skill set to be completely useless
The answer to your problem is not more schooling.
Seems like you would be in a similar situation, a degree and no experience, although that’s probably a bit more common for law school grads.
black_ops Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > A body of work, right. If my MBA told me how to > create a body of work, I would have most > definitely done so. As it stands now I do not know > how to write an equity analysis report. I know all > about equity but I don’t know how to write a > report about it all. I have called and e-mailed > many financial boutiques (40) asking for time to > speak with them and if they have opportunities for > internships. None of them have any interest in > hiring me. The standard responses I get are “We do > not have the facilitate to accommodate an > internship right now”. > > Anyways, this thread is not about me complaining > or answering questions about how useless the MBA > and CFA are for me or what I have/have not done to > try and get a job. Rest assured I have tried hard. > It’s obvious that the finance profession does not > deem my skills valuable. So I am considering other > alternatives. How old are you? Where did you get your MBA from? If you confidently say you can not write an “Equity Analysis Report”, despite being a CFA and MBA, what makes you think you will be successful in a career in law? Are there lawyers who do not speak English?
Law is not really where you want to be, unless you just really want to be a lawyer. If you are unsure, I would say don’t do it. A friend of mine recently finished a Harvard or Yale law (just to keep it ambiguous for y’all) with good grades/connects. He/she got a first year clerkship (just finishing up), but he/she has had no luck with the second year.
JOE2010 Wrote: > > > How old are you? Where did you get your MBA from? > If you confidently say you can not write an > “Equity Analysis Report”, despite being a CFA and > MBA, what makes you think you will be successful > in a career in law? Are there lawyers who do not > speak English? 26. Concordia JMSB in Montreal. Pretty useless program IMO. Despite my nagging, they never got me an internship. Oddly the internship is a requirement for passing the program and they marked it as a “pass” on my transcript… Grounds for legal action? Perhaps. They never taught me how to write an equity report. Sure I’ve done the CFA material and analyzed businesses and stuff, but I haven’t been taught how to integrate it all. I think you misread my paragraph. The point I was trying to get across was that I am having no success in getting an internship anywhere. So if I can’t even get an internship why waste time trying to put together a crappy equity report. I mean do I REALLY need to spend 10 days writing a 50 page equity report? If recruiters barely look over one page of a CV, then what’s the point of writing so much more? Especially if they don’t even have room for internships. I was thinking Law because it is a career change. Like “dmnyc” stated, Structured Finance seems to be rendering itself a useless career path for young minds. So it’s either 1) A lawyer, or 2) a doctor. I am thinking about lawyer because it’s less pre-requisites and my MBA/CFA stuff will be somewhat useful if I ever get into a business law program. I could also go into Medicine. If I did that I’d probably be set, but it’s a longer road ~ 5 years studying before I graduate and land a paid residence. So you see, I am not looking to commit myself to the Structured Finance industry because it is unappealing to me right now. I am looking for a career change that could (optimally) make use of my MBA/CFA knowledge. That is why I am considering business law.
MBA/CFA would be considered a plus for business law. Note however that even in good times only the top graduates of the top law schools have probable access to the high-paying legal jobs. I also can’t emphasize enough that getting into and completing one of those programs, getting a legal job, and being successful in a legal career require a high level of initiative.
black_ops Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > JOE2010 Wrote: > > > > > > How old are you? Where did you get your MBA > from? > > If you confidently say you can not write an > > “Equity Analysis Report”, despite being a CFA > and > > MBA, what makes you think you will be > successful > > in a career in law? Are there lawyers who do > not > > speak English? > > 26. Concordia JMSB in Montreal. Pretty useless > program IMO. Despite my nagging, they never got me > an internship. Oddly the internship is a > requirement for passing the program and they > marked it as a “pass” on my transcript… Grounds > for legal action? Perhaps. > > They never taught me how to write an equity > report. Sure I’ve done the CFA material and > analyzed businesses and stuff, but I haven’t been > taught how to integrate it all. I think you > misread my paragraph. The point I was trying to > get across was that I am having no success in > getting an internship anywhere. So if I can’t even > get an internship why waste time trying to put > together a crappy equity report. I mean do I > REALLY need to spend 10 days writing a 50 page > equity report? If recruiters barely look over one > page of a CV, then what’s the point of writing so > much more? Especially if they don’t even have room > for internships. > > I was thinking Law because it is a career change. > Like “dmnyc” stated, Structured Finance seems to > be rendering itself a useless career path for > young minds. So it’s either 1) A lawyer, or 2) a > doctor. I am thinking about lawyer because it’s > less pre-requisites and my MBA/CFA stuff will be > somewhat useful if I ever get into a business law > program. I could also go into Medicine. If I did > that I’d probably be set, but it’s a longer road ~ > 5 years studying before I graduate and land a paid > residence. > > So you see, I am not looking to commit myself to > the Structured Finance industry because it is > unappealing to me right now. I am looking for a > career change that could (optimally) make use of > my MBA/CFA knowledge. That is why I am considering > business law. I think you would be doing another big mistake to start a degree in law. Nothing bad about many qualifications (I have several), but without work experience they do not mean much. The world does not owe anything for having qualifications, you need to get out of your comfort zone and face the reality. What can you show for your interest in finance? Do you have a personal portfolio? Do you have any skills in financial modeling? The real world works differently. This non-sense of “they never taught you how to write an equity report” will not get you anywhere. You need a more proactive attitude.
Then again, by the logic we are using, you should become a petroleum engineer or a geologist since those are the hot fields now. Either that, or become a genius mathematician. That never goes out of style. Bottom line: find something you want to do. If you can’t find that, then find the next thing you can tolerate that pays well. If you can’t find that, then become a teacher and enjoy summers off. Plus, girls will think you’re sensitive.