Yea that was a little difficult to follow. Plus could you not assume that there would still be private daycare you could pay up for if the provided care wasnt up to your standards, similar to private schools? I dont really give 2 hoots about the issue either way though as I am not canadian nor am I having a child any time soon
I really enjoy watching people slowly go crazy. Pretty sure that’s what’s happening here.
Couldn’t a similar argument be made against the public school system? Seems like it’s almost the exact same thing, really, just the kids are a little bit younger.
Happened with ACE a while ago I saw off those old threads. Guess MLA is short circuiting (great film) also
This is why I think public daycare isn’t unreasonable.
school requires teaching kids things. maybe you could argue that JK and SK are not necessary but once you get to grade 1 and higher, everyone would prefer if someone with half a brain was trying to teach the kids arithmetic or why the sun rises in the east. you want some qualification process for these teachers. daycare requires no knowledge whatsoever. the best daycare “teachers” are not necessarily the ECEs but the ones that actually care for the kids. this is even more true than it is for regular teachers.
forcing most daycare workers across the entire country to be an ECE and rapidly increasing the number of publically funded ECEs, will instigate these ECEs to join local teacher’s unions which will also end up representing the other daycare workers who are not ECEs, increasing the cost of childcare substantially across the board.
the reason why the argument “isn’t this just like school?” doesn’t apply is because i might consider private school for my kid, because there are obvious benefits, but why would i spend $30,000 a year for my 2 year old to do exactly what he/she would do in a $1,000 a year daycare. it’s not like your kids are going to learn more in fancipants daycare but they will definitely learn much more in private school. it’s not like their resume will include, “went to the fanciest daycare on the planet” when they’re 20. almost always do you see prestigious private high schools on resumes or bios. plus, sending your kid to a private high school exposes them to lots of rich and soon to be successful people. it’s not like your kid is networking in daycare.
because almost nobody will want to spend $30,000 on their infant to go to fancy daycare, they will not exist. rich people will opt to hire help to come to their house to look after their kids as well as act as a part time maid. they do this now. increasing the cost of care will only push the less rich who do not want public daycare to do the same.
i have kids in daycare. i went to a private school. my kids have gone to the nice daycare and not so nice daycare. there isn’t really much of a difference. please trust me on this. in my city, which is one of the higher income and lower COL in the country, the current differential between a lower end day care and a higher end daycare is $200 per month. the lower end daycare has a 1 year waiting list. the higher end daycare has a capacity utilization rate of ~70%. this tells you that people’s utility wrt higher end daycare is very low. if you adjusted this gap to $1,200 a month, or even higher as the cost of private daycare would likely need to go up to accomodate smaller operations or lower cap ute rates, i bet the higher end daycare will not exist. plus, at $1,400 a month currently, the higher end daycare is quite close to just hiring in help, especially if you have multiple kids, and the difference in utility between lower end daycare and higher end daycare and higher end daycare and in-home daycare is insane.
I send my kid to a high end daycare. The education standards are much better than your borderline regulated piece of junk child drop. Teaching even at age 2-3 can have significant benefits. Hence why I think a voucher system is good. But MLA still hasn’t addressed why he believes in state schools but not state daycares, other than choice (then he goes on to say choice doesn’t matter in daycare, only in schools). It’s a bit contradictory my friend.
all kids need schooling. if all schools were private, the class you were born into will be the class you will very likely end up living in. if we had private schools only it would be a hindrance to equality. it is very likely more expensive to run the educational system as a public one but it is an important part in maintaining a cohesive society. i went to private school but would be okay with private schools being disallowed so long as good programs were in place in the public system for those with superior mental faculties.
private schools are mostly worth it. private daycares are not. some people can see the value in a higher end daycare now but all you really get is better food and a cleaner environment so the utility is minimal. the reason i don’t like the higher end daycare in my area is because they don’t care about the kids. if you make the cost 1500% higher, the utility for almost everyone falls to near zero. my take on higher end daycares is my own. it doesn’t reflect my view on daycare choice. my stance against nationalized daycare reflects what’s fair for everyone and thus reflects my view on choice. plus, i respect the efficiencies brought by free markets wrt daycare. although i may sound like a hyper-liberal, i am always balancing the costs of initiating programs with societal benefits. because society gets very little from nationalized daycare, i see no reason to do so. it’s better to just subsidize parents and let them choose their care, or not. paying a high child benefit and nationalizing daycare are the same thing. there is no equalizing factor directly linked to nationalized daycare.
finally, you’re wrong, almost all studies show that there is no benefit of higher quality “education” below age 5. if you lived in ontario, you’d know that the introduction of our JK program was met with dozens of studies that all concluded that the quality of education doesn’t matter before SK at the earliest, and more likely grade 1 or 2.
You should have seen him before he was ACE.
yea ive seen the old phillip.platt posts when CVM brought them up. Wild stuff for sure
Private school in Canada? For some reason that tickled me. I guess I thought the Canadians were a little more egalitarian than that. Granted, I send my kids to private school but I live in the US. Canada always seemd like the kind of place where you didn’t need to worry about health insurance and you could send your kids to public school.
^ Public schools are great here. There is more disparity in childcare pre-kindergarten. I’ll have no issue sending my kids to public schools.
^ If all you want to do is go to University of Calgary, or University of Manitoba, who gives a crap where you go to high school?
Canada has a strong private school world, just like the US. Like this place (my former school’s rival/counterpart in Toronto) http://www.ucc.on.ca/admission/tuition-fees/. $34k/yr CDN. If you want to go to a US university, you’re likely to have way better luck going to a private school. When I was in Canada I went to one of these “top tier” private schools. My classmates were, for the most part, children of successful, well off professionals. Social mobility might be a bit better in Canada than the US, but the 1% is the 1% regardless of the country.
i grew up in north brampton which is very blue collar and full of new immigrants. no good schools within 30km. in public school, by grade 2, the teacher would leave the room and put me in charge of teaching my fellow classmates math. needless to say, change was required. there were no publically funded gifted programs anwhere near where i lived.
my personal experience is why i would be okay with the abolishment of private schools, if it for some reason came to that, only if gifted programs are offered literally everywhere and are beefed up to be in the realm of private school quality.
canada is like the US, we just have fewer really bad areas with really bad schools. take your average school in upstate new york and it will look pretty much like the average school in ontario ex-GTA. if our public system was so much better, you’d be seeing a lot more of us taking your jobs.
so ACE= Phillip Platt?
So you’re against private schools on the basis you were able to get a better education than others due to your family’s income? And you would rather bring everyone down to the lowest level for the sake of “equality”? Furthermore, you think banning - aka restricting something via the threat of imprisonment, violence, theft, etc - someone from choosing the way they want to educate their children is the best course of action?
Go **** yourself.
Let’s end this thread please. I’ve been bitten by the troll too many times.
Yeah, I think that pretty much covers it.
yo klink. you will never convince these types that “the ends justify the means” is an immoral argument. they are fine using force to achieve an outcome. of course that makes them ‘evil’ for lack of a better word, but they don’t seem to get that. unfortunately it seems their numbers are growing and our numbers are shrinking.
I don’t know about that. Libertarian candidates have gained votes each election cycle for the last couple decades. And, even within the two party system, it seems to me the number of fiscally conservative, socially progressive people are growing. It’s just the far right and far left that make the most noise.
And, I’ll say it again, libertarians do a horrible job of marketing the party. We need a really good PR firm.
^…yet we seem to be less free every election cycle, every year.