^ noted.
I agreed with what you said, but this is just wrong.
Well, it’s easier to find a chick when you have a chick. Even if you have a 2, you can stick with her until you upgrade to a 3. Then you stay with her until you upgrade to a 4.
Trust me–chicks know when you don’t have a chick. They have this strange sixth sense about them that says, “Greenman doesn’t have a chick.” And they want nothing to do with you when you don’t. So get a chick–any chick. Then upgrade.
If you spend your whole life waiting for a 10, then you might be waiting for a long long long time.
The exact same thing is true with jobs. If you substitute the word “job” for “chick” in the above sentence, the statement remains 100% true.
I strongly disagree with you. Upon graduation I found it extremely difficult to break into the industry: that is, I broke into, but internal restucturing occured way too early. I sucked it up for a few years and went abroad. That was a major breakthrough for my career. Despite crisis and all,I got my dream job in wildwood place… That one led to another job in similar field which has not lasted. When the world broke down, the corporate strategy changed and my husband left me… I still managed to secure another job, in exactly similar field. That way, I had no single idle day off the CFA qualifying work. If you are committed, everything is possible. As San Tsu says, the fight for survival unleashes the forces unknown. You probably never had to figh for survival. Stop whining! And as for the exam, well, I have not even tried level 2 this year - no time to sit for it. I have my professional experience, I know L2 curriculum relevant to my job. SOmehow I stopped caring to pass - CFA does not pay my bills!
With jobs this works, because companies don’t have feelings. It’s just plain rude to treat people like they’re space fillers though. I am not saying wait for 10s, but I am saying show some self respect and common sense. If you’re a six don’t be mad with a five, but if you’re an eight don’t go for a two. This is just self awareness.
NANA and GREENMEN72 - I totally agree with both of you - a lot of people try to break into the field of finance to make “money” rather than to enjoy the acutal finance.
I’m not saying making money is wrong, but if you want to make money you have to start somewhere - and BEGGARS CAN’T BE CHOOSERS
One thing does bother me because some people in other departments think that I make a lot of money because I’m in corporate finance - and I try to convince them, no I still have to earn my stripes, network and improve myself just like any other fields. I wonder if media played a role in categorizing all finance people as 6 figure making investment bankers.
Yes. Also movies like Wall Street 2, and all the other finance movies that show people on wall street makings tons of money are all to blame.
@lxwarr - Hopefully you picked up on the fact that this was tongue-in-cheek, or sarcasm, or metaphor, or hyperbole, or whatever you want to call it. Not meant to be taken literally.
However, I am serious about the job thing. Too many people I know went to Local State University and graudated with their BBA in finance. I saw them a few months later saying, “Can you believe it? I got a lowball job offer for a mere $45k!!! I can’t live on that!”
Meanwhile, I’m thinking, “I have an MBA in finance. I have passed all four levels of the CPA exam, and Level 1 of the CFA exam, and I’m making $30k per year at a shtty state government agency. Get over yourself.”
But it worked. I moved up from that job and took another job, then moved up from that one.
What kinds of finance jobs are you looking at? If you’re looking at corporate finance, highlighting your personal portfolio returns is not a smart thing to do. Employers see that and figure you actually want to be a portfolio manager and are just looking for a paycheck until you find the job you really want. Why would you expect them to invest in you? If you’re trying to get into AM or IB, the big shops very rarely hire from anywhere other than the very top schools, so set your sights much lower and look at niche and regional firms. If you’re already doing that and still striking out, you’re likely doing something very wrong in your interviews so arrange some mock interviews with the career services office at your school or with a professional headhunter.
It’s like models and actors, obviously the potential is there and there are people who are making the big bucks.
But there are millions of aspiring models and actors who are starving and they all think and claim or actually are talented, beautiful, hardworking and got what it takes physically and mentally to be a super star - but do they all become Kate Moss or Beyonce or Angelina Jolie?
People just need to understand the industry is tough and it has to do with luck and perhaps “feng shui”? I don’t know, i’m glad i have a job in finance eventhough i don’t make the crazy Wall Street 2 salaries and bonuses but i still make relatively mroe than average.
All i can say is there are lots of room between zeroes and heroes.
NANA
Success = Talent + Luck
Moreover, in this game, the luck you have in the early phases tends to compound. That doesn’t mean you aren’t skilled too. But it means that luck has a huge impact on the results.
If you take a bunch of people who have been selected most of their lives based on meritocratic results (grades in school, performance in simulations and exams), then suddenly start rewarding them based on die rolls without telling them, the successful will start to attribute their success to their skill. Why should they think otherwise? They’ve always succeeded because of skill in the past, why should things be different now, particularly since it isn’t obvious that they’re being baid by die roll? Those that lose might blame luck, or they might blame themselves. Most likely they will start by blaming themselves, but eventually decide it’s bad luck. So they are slow learners (as opposed to the winners, who might not be learning at all).
Moreover, the more skilled the average competitor is, the more luck determines the result. Even in games where skill is critical, if the differences in skill are small, then the results of luck determine the majority of outcomes.
You won’t find last years’ best performing hedge fund managers saying that though. So make sure you know it at least.
Fk my life I cant get a job, maybe time to become a Jigalo and seduce rich old pervy Russian/Saudi billionaire men?
Which province are you in and what school did you go to? Canada actually has a lot of opportunity for finance careers (especially if you are willing to relocate to a major city) so we should consider ourselves lucky.
If you are getting the interviews but not the jobs then it might have less to do with finance being dead and more to do with fit which can definitely be a deal breaker.
Another thought…maybe you are over-qualified for the jobs you are applying for and your interviewers are worried that you won’t stick around.
I chalk this up to a case of severely rustled jimmies.
Canada has an oversupply of labour in finance.
Though everyone’s experiences may vary, I think the original author has a real point here. My read-through on this, as someone that works in the hedge fund industry – he’s absolutely right in that grades, CFA, and other stuff can only take you so far. People here spend so much time obsessing about CFA and other exams and forget what the investment business is all about: generating ideas. People should be focused on developing great stock ideas, writing them up, and submitting them to potential employers. This is how you get into the business. But nobody seems to talk about this on the forum except for a handful of people, who probably found their investment management/equity research/hedge fund jobs (by generating ideas, naturally).
I can’t tell you on any given week how many resumes I get from people with great investment banking, private equity, and other miscellaneous pedigrees. Of course I love to see accomplished people reaching out to me. However, I get so many inquiries from Harvard, Stanford, Princeton, Wharton, whatever other good school alums out there, and some of these kids are probably more intelligent, polished, better-looking, and interesting than me anyway.
But that’s not the point. Even though I want to help other alumni and give some kid career advice over a cup of coffee, I just can’t do that with every single person. The ones that do get my attention are the ones with great investment ideas. If it’s something that I think can make money for my portfolio, I’m happy to take a call with them. Maybe I’m less “white shoed” or “blue blooded” than others in the investment industry, but I’m really more interested in the ideas that someone can come up with and less interested in their pedigree.
My focus is on picking good stocks. Can you help me do that? If so, let’s talk. I don’t really care where you went to school (though I am certainly partial to fellow alums), what you’re wearing, what your parents do, or whatever. Be thoughtful, respectful, and on-time, and come at me with good investment ideas. I may not be hiring, but if I like your idea then I’m willing to maintain a relationship and even possibly pass your info on to someone else.
This is how people get jobs. This is how I got my job.
I have to ask, if its so bad out there then what’s the reason for most people here for pursing the CFA?
I work in corporate finance for a food company right now and hate it. I feel like I’m working for the DMV, really want to move to financial services but it doesn’t look so good if the industry is hurting this badly…
^ Quit your whining and get me my damn TPS Report!
I think a big part of career planning that people don’t see, and subsequently don’t take advantage of, is complementary roles that aren’t true “finance”, but may still assist. I fell victim to this for a while, but then wised up to reality.
I think I’m doing what I said… I worked for a Big 4 acct firm, hated it and saw no future to what I wanted, but at the same time didn’t really see a way into a true finance role (ER/IB/BS) because I only had 1 year of experience. So I took a job with a research and consulting firm that specializes in (and is well regarded) the industry I want to stay in. Recent exits from my company have been to consulting, A&D/Biz development roles in industry, industry technical firms, and other roles.
Overall most people don’t take a realistic view of the job market and themselves, and as a result, don’t realize that for the most part, you’re not the shit. Especially with only a few years of experience, and without good experience, you’re not really any different from the other 100 resumes in a pile.