Personally, I think a top 5 MBA is significantly harder to attain than the CFA…mainly because of the exclusivity. In terms of grey matter, the bottom performers of a top 10 MBA could pass the CFA if motivated.
P.Eng., anyone?
In my business card after my name I always add “Certified Foot Long,” has not led to any interviews yet, but works wonders in the bar scene. but seriously, never EVER, under any circumstance put MBA. It’s like advertising to the world that you are an unsecure DB.
Markbot, Of course anyone can pass the CFA if properly motivated. You do not need an MBA to do that. I do not have an MBA, and graduated with less than a 3.0 GPA from a garbage undergrad that nobody has heard of (never studied, didnt see the point at the time), and got motivated and I passed CFA 3 for 3 in 2.5 years. What I do know is that I worked side by side with kids that have a top 5 MBA but no CFA, and in terms of investment management I was no less knowledgeable, I would even venture to say I was more knowledgeable. Anyone can pass CFA if they put the time in. Anyone can get top MBA, if they put time in, have money and have connections.
What is great about the CFA is that everyone is on equal footing, no affirmative action, no my father is best friends with the dean.
http://online.wsj.com/public/article/SB119310926455468133.html From the WSJ. Sorry if this has already been posted. May give a Non-AF slant to the issue.
needhelp Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > i have an MBA and a CFA. my thoughts: > > anyone can get an MBA > anyone whose dad is rich can get a top 5 MBA > not everyone can get a CFA Ouch buddy, that doesn’t make us poor MBAs with mortgage sized student loan balances feel so good. Listen, a top business school is frickin hard to get into, especially if you fit one of the standard applicant molds (they get a lot of bankers, a lot of super smart international applicants, etc.) but the truth of the matter is that once you get in you can make the program as rigorous as you want it to be in many cases. To needhelps point, not all MBA degrees are created equal. When I went to b-school there were a lot of brilliant people who took the toughest courses and a lot of people who just needed a degree and a job. There were people there to network and get sh*tfaced between Thursday and Sunday and people there to complete their JD/MBA or MD/MBA or do a Bachelor’s and Master’s in 5 years. The great thing about a CFA is that is one standard set of tests that everyone takes that nobody can make snotty remarks at (see above for a prime example of some of the crap that gets hurled at MBAs, whether you busted your balls in school or not). Can you do alright with a top MBA degree alone? Possibly. But even in B-school, the people with their CFAs are at the top of the list when it comes to getting the best jobs in finance. I know because I have had to go head to head with those people when it came time to find a job - on every short list, at every second round of interviews, and at every invitation-only recruiting dinner, the CFAs that wanted to be there were typically there. Thankfully there were enough jobs for everyone but trust me that those with the CFAs spent a fraction of the time preparing for interviews (after all, after level one, how much preparation do you need to walk someone through an income statement or define WACC? Talk about deferred taxes? EBITDA? Free Cash Flow?)
“Anyone can pass CFA if they put the time in. Anyone can get top MBA, if they put time in, have money and have connections.” Minor point…I know many people that are intellectually incapable of getting the CFA charter or a top MBA even if they spent their entire lives studying. Hypothetically, if one were to be super motivated and studied 30 hours a week for 5 years then yes…I think the majority of these people could get the CFA and into a decent MBA program (probably not a top program because it’s about more than your gmat score). However, the point is that getting an MBA or CFA is a “signal” that this level of achievement is relatively easy…not costly…which is why you went for it. For lesser people getting a CFA or MBA would be too costly…thus they avoid it.
Kwekoolio Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > needhelp Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > i have an MBA and a CFA. my thoughts: > > > > anyone can get an MBA > > anyone whose dad is rich can get a top 5 MBA > > not everyone can get a CFA > > > Ouch buddy, that doesn’t make us poor MBAs with > mortgage sized student loan balances feel so good. > > > Listen, a top business school is frickin hard to > get into, especially if you fit one of the > standard applicant molds (they get a lot of > bankers, a lot of super smart international > applicants, etc.) but the truth of the matter is > that once you get in you can make the program as > rigorous as you want it to be in many cases. > > To needhelps point, not all MBA degrees are > created equal. When I went to b-school there were > a lot of brilliant people who took the toughest > courses and a lot of people who just needed a > degree and a job. There were people there to > network and get sh*tfaced between Thursday and > Sunday and people there to complete their JD/MBA > or MD/MBA or do a Bachelor’s and Master’s in 5 > years. > > The great thing about a CFA is that is one > standard set of tests that everyone takes that > nobody can make snotty remarks at (see above for a > prime example of some of the crap that gets hurled > at MBAs, whether you busted your balls in school > or not). Can you do alright with a top MBA degree > alone? Possibly. But even in B-school, the people > with their CFAs are at the top of the list when it > comes to getting the best jobs in finance. I know > because I have had to go head to head with those > people when it came time to find a job - on every > short list, at every second round of interviews, > and at every invitation-only recruiting dinner, > the CFAs that wanted to be there were typically > there. Thankfully there were enough jobs for > everyone but trust me that those with the CFAs > spent a fraction of the time preparing for > interviews (after all, after level one, how much > preparation do you need to walk someone through an > income statement or define WACC? Talk about > deferred taxes? EBITDA? Free Cash Flow?) i think i was exaggerating in my post for the sake of sensationalism and attention. please discard.
My opinion is that a top 5 MBA is way better than the CFA Charter…for recruiting, knowledge, business skills, picking up women…etc. Imagine the following scenario…you are at a bar and you start chatting up a pretty girl. Scenario for only CFA holder: Girl: So where did you go to school? You: I have an undergrad at [so and so school] and a CFA charter. Girl: What is the CFA? You: Chartered financial analyst…it’s like a master’s in finance. Girl: Oh, that’s nice…thanks for the drink…very nice meeting you Scenario for top MBA and CFA holder: Girl: So where did you go to school? You: I went to [insert top 5 MBA program name] Girl: Wow, that’s a really great school [code for, you must have a lot of earnings potential and can thus buy me lots of things] You: Thanks, can I buy you another drink? Girl: Want to go some place more private? My roommate is out of town this weekend. You: Sure…
I know a girl who used to sign her name “Jane Doe, 36D”…surprisingly enough she got a lot of interviews.
^that is hilarious and probably not too far off. Isn’t it customary to include include professional designations after your name (e.g. CPA, CFA, P.Eng)? Whereas degrees are more of a gray area. With that said, if I had a Harvard MBA, I would probably put MBA after my name. If I had a University of Phoenix online MBA, I would do everything I could to make sure NOBODY knew about it.
My two cents… as I see it the reason its more common to see esq, DR, etc is bc these are all based on a standard exam where there is not really much of a variance in terms of accomplishment. You pass the bar, done- thats it. Its tricky with MBA bc its so broad. It does not tightly define the accomplishment- like many have said- a top 5 MBA will be a lot more influential than CFA but putting “MBA” behind your name does not indicate that accomplishment. CFA=CFA clear and simple. Jane can have harvard MBA or phoenix online MBA and its still Jane, MBA. Do the only way to be sure its properly interpreted would be to put Jane, Harvard MBA and I’ll step out there to say that this would be considered universally as a DB move. Since thats the case no one puts MBA bc generically it doesn’t show much and nothing is better that uber douche Jane, Wharton Grad.
markbot Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > My opinion is that a top 5 MBA is way better than > the CFA Charter…for recruiting, knowledge, > business skills, picking up women…etc. > > Imagine the following scenario…you are at a bar > and you start chatting up a pretty girl. > > Scenario for only CFA holder: > Girl: So where did you go to school? > You: I have an undergrad at and a CFA charter. > Girl: What is the CFA? > You: Chartered financial analyst…it’s like a > master’s in finance. > Girl: Oh, that’s nice…thanks for the > drink…very nice meeting you > > Scenario for top MBA and CFA holder: > Girl: So where did you go to school? > You: I went to > Girl: Wow, that’s a really great school > You: Thanks, can I buy you another drink? > Girl: Want to go some place more private? My > roommate is out of town this weekend. > You: Sure… Do top mba’s usually have roommates?
juventurd Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > Scenario for top MBA and CFA holder: > > Girl: So where did you go to school? > > You: I went to > > Girl: Wow, that’s a really great school > > You: Thanks, can I buy you another drink? > > Girl: Want to go some place more private? My > > roommate is out of town this weekend. > > You: Sure… > > Do top mba’s usually have roommates? -1 (The chick has the roomate)
When I worked at a BB I once got a resume from a girl from USC for an analsyt type job. Took forever to open file. Turns out she had a full body photo of her on her resume. She was smoking. Did not even read resume but forwarded to everyone on our desk. We had a girl with 36D’s that was hired to be a traders asst. She sucks…in more ways then one.
I most definitely put MBA after my name… My Name, MBA: SUNY Buffalo VP Consumer and Industrial Products Division Houlihan Lokey
goldenboy09 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > When I worked at a BB I once got a resume from a > girl from USC for an analsyt type job. Took > forever to open file. Turns out she had a full > body photo of her on her resume. She was smoking. > Did not even read resume but forwarded to everyone > on our desk. > > > We had a girl with 36D’s that was hired to be a > traders asst. She sucks…in more ways then one. ha ha, nice
markbot Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Scenario for top MBA and CFA holder: > Girl: So where did you go to school? > You: I went to > Girl: Wow, that’s a really great school > You: Thanks, can I buy you *another* drink? D-bag alert. Buying girls drinks (-1 each) + trying to sell yourself w/ MBA douchebaggery = -3.
artvandalay Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > goldenboy09 Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > When I worked at a BB I once got a resume from > a > > girl from USC for an analsyt type job. Took > > forever to open file. Turns out she had a full > > body photo of her on her resume. She was > smoking. > > Did not even read resume but forwarded to > everyone > > on our desk. > > > > > > We had a girl with 36D’s that was hired to be a > > traders asst. She sucks…in more ways then > one. > > ha ha, nice whats said is we did interview her